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Photography Question 
Kelly S. Andrews
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/31/2002

Trouble Working With High Resolution Scans

I am using an Epson 2450 scanner to scan my color negatives. I just started scanning at 1200 dpi because I want to print the images as 8x10 and I want the image to be excellent. Adobe PS Elements 1.0.1 came with the scanner and I have been using it to crop and clean up the images. When scanning at 300 dpi I don't have any problems, however with the 1200 dpi images, every time I try to save an image after I have resized it and cropped it to 8x10, the whole machine freezes up and PS stops responding.

I have a brand new Dell 4600 with Pentium 4 2.66 GHZ and 512 MB DRAM so the machine should be able to handle this. I tried the same scenario using Jasc Paint Shop Pro which came as a trial on the machine and the system does not freeze. I called Dell and we went through making several system changes including stopping all background processes from running and nothing helped. Now they want me to reinstall Windows XP which would be a real pain.

Is anybody else scanning and saving large images (around 4MB jpegs)? Could it be the PS Elements version that is bad? I really don't want to have to buy the Jasc Paint Shop Pro upgrade for $75 and it seems that most people here use PS. I have gotten to know the PS Elements fairly well and don't really want to switch any way.

Any suggestions or ideas are welcome!

Thanks in advance!

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7/24/2003 11:25:12 AM

doug Nelson   Adobe treats its Elements owners better than it does its Photoshop customers. Ask them about 1.0.1 and Windows XP conflicts. You may solve this by buying Elements 2.0. Paintshop Pro is a decent product for its purpose, but there are fewer books on it. It doesn't sound to me as if your problem is insufficient RAM or hard drive space.
When you get this problem solved, I suggest you scan at the full 2400 ppi. This gives you more to work with in the beginning.

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7/25/2003 5:42:53 AM

Chris London   Hi Kelly,
I had a similar problem with Photoshop 6 and 7. Seems it has trouble with some motherboards. There is a fix (although it slows performance a bit, it has worked flawlessly for me since I did this). It says for Pentium 3 computers, but it may have been inherited by your P4 as well. Might be worth trying, since it does not make PS unusable.

From Adobe website:
Photoshop 5.5 or Later Crashes or Freezes on Pentium 3 Computers

Adobe Photoshop 5.5 or later crashes or freezes on a computer that has an Intel Pentium 3 processor.
If the computer manufacturer is Dell Computer Corporation, the system may return the error "Alert: Regulator Error."
Contact the motherboard or computer manufacturer for assistance resolving this issue, which occurs because of an electrical problem on some motherboards.
Note: As a temporary workaround on some computers, you can disable the extensions that optimize data movement in Photoshop. Performance, however, will slow noticeably. To disable the extensions, move the Extensions folder out of the Plug-Ins folder:
1. Exit from Photoshop.
2. In Windows Explorer, move the Extensions folder from the Program Files/Adobe/Photoshop [version]/Plug-Ins/Adobe Photoshop Only folder to a location outside of the Adobe folder (for example, move it to the desktop).
3. Restart Photoshop.
Additional Information
The electrical problem on the affected motherboards is triggered by computer operations that use the pathway (called a bus) between the processor and the RAM for an extended number of microseconds. This problem can be triggered by the operating system or other applications; however, it often appears when using Photoshop because few other applications move memory as rapidly as Photoshop does.
This problem occurs with Dell Optiplex GX1 computers and ASUS P2B-F and P3B-F motherboards and may also occur with other motherboards.

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7/29/2003 3:21:58 AM

Kelly S. Andrews
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/31/2002
  Hi Doug and Chris,

Thank you both for your responses. For the past week I have just been using Paintshop Pro with no problems (usually). I am getting a copy of Adobe PS 5 from a friend to try and see if I have the same problems. Performance is already pretty slow when I am working with these big files so I don't know if I want to affect performance any further.

Doug - you said that I should scan at 2400 dpi, however a scan at 1600 is taking about 30 minutes - does that sound right to you? I can't believe it is that slow. I have a Bus 2 connection which I thought was supposed to be faster.

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7/29/2003 5:44:38 AM

Thomas Lonergan
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/30/2001
  Just a note about re-installing windows. It has been my experience over the last 5 years, that any time a technician can't figure out how to solve your problem, they tell you to re-install with your rescue disk. Easy for them, difficult for you.

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7/29/2003 7:10:54 AM

doug Nelson   I've never used a flatbed for scanning 35-mm negs or slides, but the optical recognition specs suggest that the scanner is supposed to be able to do it. I've found Epson to have pretty good support; have you called them? Ask them: Could USB 2 be that slow? Would Firewire be that much faster?
Also, read what Photoshop says about allocating some of your hard drive space to use a a "scratch disk". I think it may be 5 times the amount of RAM you have. With the huge hard drives computers have lately, it shouldn't tax your system that much. In the meantime, i'll search through my stuff and see how PS 5 tells you to do that.

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7/29/2003 10:03:06 AM

Kelly S. Andrews
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/31/2002
  Hi Thomas - I agree! I am actually a software support consultant for Manufacturing ERP software and I could tell the guy I had on the phone didn't really "know" anything - he was just reading from their Knowledgebase and searching for the next suggestion.

Doug - thanks for your suggestions too. I haven't called Epson yet, but I did just install Adobe 5.0 from a friend and I was able to work with and save the larger files with no problem - including some I scanned at 1600. I will do some time tests with the higher resolution scans to see exactly how much time it takes and then maybe I will contact Epson. If you find out how to allocate some of the hard drive space to use a scratch disk, I would be interested to know. Thanks!

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7/30/2003 6:09:01 AM

doug Nelson   On some versions of PS, it's under File/Preferences. It will ask how much of your hard drive you want to assign to Scratch disk. Unless your hard drive is cluttered with games and stuff, maybe 20 or 25% is reasonable. As I understand it, this only functions when what you're doing exceeds the amount of RAM you have to cover it. This happens with large layered files.

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7/31/2003 6:09:45 AM

Elaine C. Carbone
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/5/2003
  Photo Elements 1.0 is not XP compatible, Photo Elements 2.0 is XP compatible. If you had downloaded the full program of Photo Elements 1.0 a warning from Xp stating this program is not XP compatible. I believe it is only compatible in Windows 98,98SE,2000. you are better of buying the full box program Of Elements 2.0 . It's well worth the money . I have XP and it is a much better operating system than Windows 98Se which use to freeze up for no reason. So when ever you purchase any new program make sure it is XP compatible. Elaine

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8/2/2003 6:23:22 PM

Thomas Lonergan
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/30/2001
  Speaking of Elements 2.0, I purchased it a month ago and love it. I'm about half way through the instruction manual, and can edit my photos well enough to do the job. I'm using Windows 98, but as already stated, it works with XP. I bought mine at Sam's Club with a $30 rebate, finally costing me $50. You might not have Sam's, but Staples has a rebate too.

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8/2/2003 7:49:45 PM

Kelly S. Andrews
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/31/2002
  Thanks so much for all of your helpful advice. I am still trying to decide if I want to buy the Jasc Paint Shop Pro upgrade as I have been using that pretty successfully, or buy the PS Elements 2.0. I like the easy framing options in Paint Shop. Can you tell me if you can add color frames easily in PS Elements? I am designing greeting cards and I like to use frames.

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8/2/2003 9:34:28 PM

Ms. Shan Canfield   I don't know if this is the case but I had a client that was doing something similar to what you are describing. So, let me recant his situation and you can determine if this applies to you. He was scanning his negatives at 1200 dpi and setting the final size to 8x10 in the scanning software interface. The scans took an enormous amount of time. Then when he tried to do anything in Photoshop...his machine froze up! What was going on? By using his scanning software dialog box and setting both the resolution and the final size, he was actually creating an RGB image that was 8x10 @ a final resolution of 1200ppi. Do you know how big of a file size that is? Well, it's enormous!
Solution 1: In the scanning dialog box, set the size to only 100% (1.5x2") approx)and the dpi to 1200. This way you get a final image that is approx 1.5x2 @1200, then when you resize it with "Resample" UNCHECKED,in Photoshop's Image Size Dialog box, the pixels reorganize themselves to around an 8x12, if you change the res from 1200 to 300 in the Image>Image Size dialog box. Be sure to UNCHECK resample before changing the Resolution Field.
Solution 2: In the scanning software dialog, choose a final size of 8x10 and a resolution of 300.
The key thing to remember for scanning is to choose one or the other. By that I mean either leave it at 100% and use the higher resolution, allowing for later resizing or change the percentage to the actual final size but use the final target resolution (300).
If you mess with both in the scan're asking for trouble.

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9/8/2003 7:54:01 AM

Fernanda    Hi Chris London,
I had the same problem with photoshop and your response helped me.
Thank you.
Fernanda Pimenta

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10/23/2003 10:30:11 PM

Ja 808   I tried to use a Dell to work on color photos, but it failed. So maybe you should do what I did.

Use a Mac!

Never a Problem.


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12/28/2004 9:56:03 PM

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