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Photography Question 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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May 2013 NO EP Feedback


It seems like lots of folks received a way lower EP count on their April entries :( This is a thread where we can post those contest entries that did not receive an EP that you would like to receive constructive ideas on why and what could be improved on the image.

Please leave feedback on the image here in this thread as many members do not wish to have critique comments directly on the thread of the images. Members may want to upload a "Forum Only" copy of the image to this thread. Please indicate if you'd rather receive critique on that thread.

Helpful links: These are the guidelines BP uses when evaluating/judging images: "How to Win a Photo Contest" (http://www.betterphoto.com/contest/guidelines.asp). Also, reference BP rules for categories: http://www.betterphoto.com/contest/categories.asp

I look forward to everyone's thoughtful and valuable feedback!


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5/9/2013 6:39:45 AM

 
Ken Beatty
BetterPhoto Member Since: 8/22/2012
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  tagging....


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5/9/2013 9:28:51 AM

 
Connie J. Bagot
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/6/2005
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  tag


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5/9/2013 4:21:17 PM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Susan, as yet, I've not entered anything in May (working on a different photo project that has a deadline.) Might get back to it in about 10 days. It sounds as if there is not hurry anyway. Btw, I went to the Better Photo Page on Facebook; it looks as though BP has disengaged there also (almost all earlier posts have been removed, too.)


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5/13/2013 4:36:11 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Facebook: Jim Miotke - Jim is still featuring some Member's photos there on occasion.


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5/13/2013 4:39:51 AM

 
Jill Odice
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/1/2005
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  I looked at the FB page and it seems there is like one guy posting images. At first I thought maybe I found the wrong page :-)


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5/13/2013 8:28:07 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  John Forrant (?) has been posting pix almost every day along with maybe 3 or 4 others on occasion. However, BP did add some threads. Now, it's as though it's all been deleted except for John's last picture in April.


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5/13/2013 8:40:18 AM

 
Kara Hendricks
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/18/2004
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  For the 1st time in months, I am attempting to enter some images that have never been on BP and a few radically re-edited ones in May, trying for 31 new ones...... I've been on a bit of a sad run photographically in the past year it seems, life has got in my way... So I have to say it's been a bummer to me that May is the month they seem to have stopped the EP's... I guess we have all become accustomed to knowing which shots go on or have caught their eye... Oh well, as with all other things with BP, change comes and we must adjust...


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5/13/2013 12:41:55 PM

 
JudyAnn Rector
route66ladyartphotos.com
  I do not understand why some do not want critique comments directly on photo threads? I thought that is what posting and commenting was supposed to be about? I have always wondered why any 'helpful' comments seemed to be avoided.

Why must we go to the extra trouble of posting an image here? Some of us barely have time to do what we love in the first place and that's take photos!

I really do not want to ruffle any feathers, but from what I can see about this special thread, it is mostly just all the same ol 'great photo' type comments anyway so what's the point... just more back slapping?

If we can toughen up and accept honest critiques where they belong, maybe we can get feedback on photos other than only those we consider our best AND include MANY more members!

No, I do not especially like to hear negative comments about my work, but it IS how we grow as photographers and doing this in the open on the main photo thread is how we grow as a community.

I am just as critical of BP as the next member, but we are not helping things by taking to the back roads.

I expect I have angered everyone, but sure hope I get some feedback because I am frustrated with the whole mess. JudyAnn


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5/26/2013 1:16:09 PM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  My reluctance to leave critiques on pictures here is two-fold. Generally, the images are already entered (I might send a private message after noticing they didn't get an EP; and suggest an "fix" and resub.) Secondly, I never know when an image was uploaded with the possibility of a sale - a public critique could squash a sale just by calling attention to something a non-photographer may never have noticed.

Other competitive sites have usually kept the critique side away from the contest side. BP really is no different in that regard. But, it truly is not a good learning atmosphere not to have open critiquing - but choosing the BP way was a choice we made in that respect. Rock/Hard Place!


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5/26/2013 3:05:12 PM

 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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  Judy, I'm not sure where you got the idea that this thread only has "great photo" comments on
it. This month there are no critiques yet and last month there were more than a few with detailed observations and specific suggestions.

The lengthy discussion about critiques on a photo thread occured on Cheri's thread about 3 months ago. A few folks felt the same way as you do. Many said they would prefer not because of prospective clients and a few because of the contest. Some of us expressed interest in a companion thread to Cheri's EP thread for non EP images so that's this. You are free to continue getting critique on your photo thread however, I have rarely, if ever, seen critique on a photo's thread here at BP. Maybe if the person invited it? I have never seen the galleries at BP as the place to point out improvements a photo needs. Classes, clubs and forums, yes. It is solicited or expected there. When I was on BP years ago I belongedto the PG101 group which was on Yahoo, a whole other site with a lot of extra steps but it was worth it for the people there and for how much I learned.

Your argument sounds a lot like another from that thread in that everyone should be ok with it because that's how we learn. For me, and I suspect others, my gallery is my "display" of my completed work versus my work in progress. I have a lot to learn still so I seek out those places. I'm always grateful for even a word or two on my photo threads because someone went to to the effort of letting me know they liked it.

I think we can all relate to not having as much time as we'd like. You can submit an image here right from your gallery. You can also ask for people to comment directly on it.


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5/26/2013 5:33:54 PM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  The April Finalists are out - Kathy Kuhn just posted 2 of hers on FB. I don't have the link for all of them.


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5/26/2013 5:39:49 PM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Here's the direct link

http://www.betterphoto.com/gallery/dynoGall2.asp?catID=56845


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5/26/2013 5:49:06 PM

 
Ken Beatty
BetterPhoto Member Since: 8/22/2012
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Here's an image that did not get an EP in April. Thoughts for improvement or is the subject not strong enough?


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5/27/2013 4:03:31 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Ken, was this a blending of bracketed shots? It almost looks as those the blurred parts are unaligned items (two area of thorns in particular.) The other thought that occurred is that the branch is too high into the space rather than running along the top line of the Thirds-grid.


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5/27/2013 6:57:39 AM

 
tony w. austin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/28/2010
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rainfeatherphotography.com
 
 
  Reflections of Paris
Reflections of Paris
everywhere you go in paris you see bicycles. this is my photograph of those bikes
© tony w. austin
rainfeatherphotograp...
Canon EOS 60D Digi...
 
 
i really thought this was a great shot for element of design... but it go skipped over


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5/27/2013 8:56:51 AM

 
Patricia Buenting
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  tagging no ep's for May


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5/27/2013 10:31:35 AM

 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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  Wow it's really getting late in the month! Glad to see a few pics posted for feedback. I have a couple I'm going to post later today. I'll also try and add some useful feedback as well.

The way things are going it seems quite possible these entries could get EPs right before the judging in June! Oh well...congrats to all who pulled in a finalist or two :)


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5/27/2013 11:36:55 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Earlier today, Leslie Morris posted this on an earlier (April EFPs?) thread:

OK guys here is another anomaly in the judging system. If you look up in this thread I put in my little gosling as being passed over in April. It WAS passed over as it is my first entry for May's contest as a re-submit. It did get a May EFP - but low and behold it also got a finalist for April. It DID NOT get its EFP until May. Go figure.


Arrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggggggghhhh! lollllllllllll


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5/27/2013 11:59:36 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  Earlier today, Leslie Morris posted this on an earlier (April EFPs?) thread:

OK guys here is another anomaly in the judging system. If you look up in this thread I put in my little gosling as being passed over in April. It WAS passed over as it is my first entry for May's contest as a re-submit. It did get a May EFP - but low and behold it also got a finalist for April. It DID NOT get its EFP until May. Go figure.


Arrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggggggghhhh! lollllllllllll


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5/27/2013 11:59:36 AM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  I seem to be "stuttering" all over the place on BP today!


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5/27/2013 12:01:07 PM

 
Ken Beatty
BetterPhoto Member Since: 8/22/2012
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  Kathy - That was a single image at iso100 1/30sec 300mm f16. It was a 1:2 Macro. Wish I had a 1:1 but the results were nice anyway.


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5/27/2013 12:26:02 PM

 
Pat Harry
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/26/2006
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  Tony & Ken - I'm wondering if it was the blurred foreground that caused a problem with the judges on both your images? I had someone tell me once that blurred foregrounds would get you. I know I've had a couple of mine passed over that I liked, and all I could come up with was the foreground.


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5/27/2013 1:05:28 PM

 
tony w. austin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/28/2010
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rainfeatherphotography.com
  pat it very well could be. that would explain another picture of a dog I submitted where the grass in the front was a little blurred to make the dog stand out more and it got skipped over.


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5/27/2013 3:06:38 PM

 
Kathy Wesserling
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2005
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  I run into that grass in front issue whenever I try to shoot a rural scene that has a fence in the foreground. Trying to focus between the blades is a challenge.


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5/27/2013 3:26:03 PM

 
Jill Odice
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/1/2005
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  zero eps, zero finalists...:-(


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5/28/2013 10:20:56 AM

 
Monnie Ryan
BetterPhoto Member Since: 9/25/2008
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  Very few EPs for April, zero finalists, so :-( for me, too. And only two EPs for May. Rather a drastic change from March, and certainly not a pleasant one.


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5/28/2013 5:41:49 PM

 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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  Hi All! I hadn't continued this thread because it became difficult to know whether or when a pic was passed over for an EP. Even now it seems like you can't be sure until Finalists for that month come out!

The rules change for resubmits has left me thinking that there is less incentive to get critique since resubmits are limited to images with substantial changes made. I'm not sure that what we had in mind here was to give suggestions for substantial changes that could be made and I'm wondering about what good suggestions for improvement are if you can't apply them for an improved (tweaked?) image? Thoughts?


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7/7/2013 5:35:14 AM

 
Nicholas Semo
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2008
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  Maybe the suggestion for improvement could be applied to the next photo we take, instead of working on one already passed over. For example, it has been suggested that some were possibly passed over because of blurred foregrounds. How about re- shooting and stopping your lens all the way down to it's minimum aperture, and then using the len's hyper focal distance for focusing. If that doesn't provide sharp enough focus in the foreground, then I suggest focus stacking to achive what you want. Apply the suggestion to your next photo instead of trying to fix one that got passed over.
Just my opinion.

Nick


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7/7/2013 6:58:56 AM

 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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  Right Nick, that was the only benefit I could think of as well. Even analysis of why BP passed it over (using their criteria of course) could be helpful to some in developing a little more critical eye. BPs judging isnt the be all end all (ive sold pieces that didnt make it past EP here!) but since we are here....

I have a few I wouldnt mind getting some feedback on. Btw Nick, your bird pics are awesome!


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7/7/2013 5:44:47 PM

 
Nicholas Semo
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2008
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  That was my point in another thread. I think some folks are giving to much weight to eps. I had said the same thing...if my photos are selling, I couldn't care less about an EP.
Thank you Susan for the comment on my bird pics. I started to get interested in birds last year, and this year I put a lot more time into it. My Nikon 200-400mm is my longest lens, so I feel totally handicapped when shooting birds. I have so much to learn about bird photography....luckily I have a great mentor.

BTW Susan your gallery is awesome. I'm jealous of your osprey photo, and your flower photos are amazing.

Nick.


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7/7/2013 6:28:37 PM

 
Patricia Buenting
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  Unwelcome Visitor
Unwelcome Visitor
© Patricia Buenting
Nikon D700 Digital...
 
 
© Patricia Buenting
Nikon D700 Digital...
 
 
I have a window that I get photos of Hummingbirds and the other day here is what popped up in my window. I was so glad the window was closed.


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7/7/2013 8:39:00 PM

 
Susan M. Smith
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/22/2004
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  Patricia....first off - yuck! Secomd, great captures amd close up detail! I really like how the window casing provides a frame for thesubject, who has no business poking in windows, but hey, since he's there grab the camera!lol

Nick, I was into birding for years but with binoculars. I'd love to shoot them now but my longest lens is a 70-300mm. That is the one I used in Florida but those birds were pretty close to me. It was one of the most exciting times shooting. I need to figure out the best places around here to shoot!


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7/9/2013 4:21:15 AM

 
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