 May Thao |
dye-sub vs. inkjet do most professional photographers use inkjet or dye-sub. Can you tell the difference between a photo that has been printed using dye-sub and ink-jet? I am in the process of purchasing a photo printer for my studio and it is so hard to decide which would benefit me in the long run. As far as injet printers is Epson better or HP? Any help on this would be appreciated greatly.
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robert G. Fately |
May, you're question is not specific enough - "profesional photographer" covers a lot of ground, and depending on what they do the answer is different. Event shooters (weddings,reunions, amateur sports) who sell prints at the scene usually go with dye-sub printers. Dye sublimation printers are much less complex; you can't "run out" of one color of ink, there's no such thing as head-clogs, and they're generally pretty fast. On the flip side, the output is limited in terms of size and finishes available - you can only use paper provided by the manufacturer and that's usually only in wallet size, 4x6, 5x7 or maybe 8x10. Pros whose work does not demand quick turnaround and who want to offer a wide array of sizes and finished turn to inkjet, where there is far more flexibility in output. As for output quality, in general dye-sub prints are more "real photograph" looking; the papers have the proper heft and glossy finish and the print quality is more tonal. Longevity studies are inconclusive - some argue that dye-sub is not archival while it's pretty well known that ink-jet can be - depending on the specific paper and ink used.
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Irene Troy |
Great topic! I was actually going to post a similar question. As I posted some weeks ago, I’ve been invited to hang some work in a gallery show this June. Currently, I use a Canon i990 inkjet printer that uses what Canon calls “archival ink”. I have been researching this issue of dye sub versus inkjet and am thoroughly confused. One source states that if you are planning to market in a gallery you really need to use dye sub because the quality and longevity are better. The next source says that good ink jet printers produce good images that have a life of 100 – 200 years. Bob, the few dye sub printers that I have looked at (online only) seem to offer the ability to print at pretty much the same size as ink jets. Is this true or am I missing something? Also, the specs do not mention the proprietary paper issue. Any insights or opinions will be most welcome. Thanks! Irene
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robert G. Fately |
First - the paper: while it's not mentioned often, the fact is that each dye sub printer requires the use of the paper specifically manufactured for it - generally offered only by the printer maker. So Kodak is the only seller of paper for their 1400 and other dye-sub printers, Sony for theirs, Mitsubishi for theirs, etc. When you buy the paper, you actually are getting a kit of both the sheets of paper and the ink ribbon. his is due to the way dye sublimation printers work - they are 4 pass type printers - moving the paper across the stationary print head along with the ink ribbon sahdwhiched in between. So there are 3 or 4 passes, one each for C, Y, M and sometimes K or perhaps a gloss overlayer. Thus, the ink ribbon is as wide as the paper itself, is fed on rollers, and has 3 (or 4) full-length sections of each color in a row. That is, the ink ribbon for Kodak's 1400 is 8.5" wide and has 12 inch long sectionss that alternate between yellow, cyan and magenta. When you make a single print - even if it's only of a 1/2" leaf in the middle of the entire sheet, a ful set of ink ribbon is used. This is why you know with certitude thateach 8x12 costs $189 or whatever - you just divide the ink/paper kit cost by the number of prints. There's no way for you to run out of magenta - it's a 1 to 1 correspondence.
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robert G. Fately |
Oops - I meant $1.89 per print... Again, this is because the paper and ink are both intrinsic components of the process. So I hope that makes some sense as far as dye sub. With inkjet, where the ink is essentially spat at the substrate, you have far more flexibility in terms of papers in terms of both manufacturers and finishes. Also, since the print head on an inkjet travels across the width of the page (the "raster process") printers can be made with much wider capacities than dye subs (where the printhead is a stationary bar the full width of the page). Thus most of the 48" or larger printers are inkjets. So the upside is flexibility of output, the downside is flexibility of supplies. That is, between the aftermarket and OEM inks out there, plus the papers avaialable from everyone in various weights, finishes and sizes, you can see the multitude of permutations possible in combining them. But this can be problematic, both for color control and longevity. If you're really trying to keep your color output right, you will need a different ICC color profile for each ink/paper combination on your printer. This is because a given inkset on smooth paper will actually reflect different color hues that that same inkset will on canvas paper, etc. As for longevity; yes, according to the labs that test such things, there are inkjet prints that can last 100+ years...but this is only when that particular inkset and paper are used in that printer. The wrong paper with the same ink could cause fading in a matter of weeks - literally. Dye sub longevity is more often debated - Kodak has long claims but the naysayers point out that's because Kodak uses wussy testing methods. I've been using Kodak dye sub printers for a few years now (originally the 8560 and now the 1400) and the prints I've hung have not faded - but they're not hit witha daily dose of direct sunlight either. I personally gave up on inkjets because I don't print all that often, and I invariably ended up replacing costly ink cartridges that were pretty full but that dried out in the weeks of disuse. So. If you're looking to make up to 8x10 (or 8x12) inch prints, the dye sub approach will give you more "photograph-y" looking prints at a consistant per-print cost (with no fading issues as far as I have seen). If you want to make 13x19 or 16x20 or whatever, then inkjet is your only choice (at least until you get to the laser or LED-powered photographic paper printers by Durst or Lightjet, but I'm assuming you don't have $250,000 lying around).
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Alan N. Marcus |
Hi May, Color print quality is absolutely a function of the dyes used and how laid down. Conventional silver based color photographs are limited to only three colors. These are cyan – magenta – yellow. Of the thousands of chemical dyes that produce these colors only a tiny handful will fill the bill. This is because the current process requires the dyes to remain colorless until endowed with a missing ingredient. The missing ingredient is in the color developer. Further, the missing ingredient must be the same for all three dyes. When one of the colorless dyes mates with this single ingredient, it blossoms to form a full blown cyan – magenta – or yellow. Since the 1940’s research has continued to improve this process. The greatest laminations are failure to secure an archrival dye set (100 year life is optimistic) and failure to yield a rich back when the three dyes overlay. Inkjet technology skips all stuff about colorless until developed. Thus inkjet engineers are free to select from a wider variety of dyes. The inkjet sprays water based inks onto the paper. For the most part, the inks remain on the surface. Yes there is some absorption but if the paper wicks the tiny droplets spread and resolution is lost. That being said, I have nothing but praise for these engineers. The main drawback for the consumer is the cost of the ink (only precious perfumes cost more per ounce). The basis of the inkjet, like silver based images, is use of the three subtractive primaries, cyan – magenta – yellow. The dyes used also fail to overlay to a rich black. Inkjets not being limited as to the number of dyes bolster contrast with the addition of a black ink. The three colors are not yet at the correct shade so advanced print engines augment using light magenta and light yellow. Sometimes black is also augmented. When so equipped the inkjet is a formidable printer. Current dyes fade with time especially when exposed to UV light. Modern inkjet now use some pigments intermixed with the dye. Some inks are applied encapsulated in a UV protected overcoat. Still missing is an archrival dye set (20 - 30 years is optimistic). It is my belief that this technology will advance exponentially. Sublimation is the name attached to: Things exist in three states; solid – liquid – gas. Ice is solid melts to a liquid, boils to a gas. Dry ice is solid, is it warms it changes to a gas skipping the liquid state. This is “sublimation”. In the Dye sublimation printer the dyes/ pigments are solids on the ribbon. To form the image the ribbon is heated in contact with the paper. The heating is localized to a tiny spot. The heated dye/pigment vaporizes. The now gas dye/pigments permeate into the paper. Once inside the gas cools and solidifies to a solid. The system uses the subtractive primaries plus black. Archrival dye/pigment sets have been achieved (solids are more stable than liquids). Results are very good. Sublimation is the king on the mountain for now. Alan Marcus
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May Thao |
I truly appreciate the response and the advice. It would be nice to use a combination of the both of them. Although with me, the prints varies from customers to customers. I would use an outside source to produce my pictures, but then I would have to charge my customers more. I want to do most of my printing in house. Right now I am looking at purchaing the HP 9180 and probably the HP 2100. I did do some reserch on the Mitsu dye-sub, too. I think for now I'll try the inkjet and see how that works for me. Supposely HP's ink are to last up to 200 yrs. according to Wilhelm's test reserch. Thanks guys I really appreciate it:)
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robert G. Fately |
Just remember, May, that ink longevity is based both on the inkset AND the paper you use...if you use the same HP ink on different paper it might fade much sooner than 200 years out. So as you review the Wilhelm reports, check to see exactly which papers are being used.
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