BetterPhoto Q&A
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Photography Question 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
 

Update: June Contest Finalists & Winners


Hi Everyone,
Just a note to share with you from the contest judges: "We are running behind ... so many great images to go through! We plan to announce the June winners by the middle of this coming week (July 26th or 27th), with the finalists announced a day or two before. Thank you for your patience."

Also, BetterPhoto has a new contest policy: Beginning with the current contest, winners will be announced by the last day of the month. Thus, for the July contest, the winners will be posted by August 31st.

We certainly understand that the wait isn't easy, but we appreciate your patience!

Thanks,

Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto.com


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7/21/2006 3:49:27 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  Kerry, thanks so much for the status update... saves a group of us from pulling out our hair and/or getting plastered on "just one more glass of wine while I wait tonite" ;) Hopefully the new last-day policy will give you all some breathing room for awhile!


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7/21/2006 4:06:25 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Christopher,
Thanks for the nice comments ... much appreciated! Glad we've saved you from the hair pulling out and/or getting plastered! :-)
Kerry


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7/21/2006 5:15:35 PM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  Well, Adolph Coors will certainly benefit from this....:-)

Bob


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7/21/2006 6:03:16 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Bob,
:-) LOL !!!
Kerry


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7/21/2006 7:15:32 PM

 
Margie Hurwich
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/16/2005
  Well, even with this news, I still enjoyed a couple tonight!!!


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7/21/2006 8:24:02 PM

 
Sherry S. Boles
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/28/2005
  Thanks so much for the announcement!
You have single-handedly improved world health by preventing many anxiety/stress attacks as we wait...lol! :)


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7/21/2006 8:37:31 PM

 
Linda D. Lester
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/13/2004
Contact Linda
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lindadlester.com
  I think it is a great idea to have a set date like the last day of the month so everyone knows when they are coming. Be sure and pick mine, Kerry! LOL!


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7/21/2006 9:23:02 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Margie, Sherry, and Linda,
Thanks so much for checking in ... I enjoyed your comments!! :-)lol
Kerry


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7/21/2006 9:39:56 PM

 
Cathy Stancil
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/16/2004
  Thanks for the info, greatly appreciated Kerry !


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7/21/2006 9:56:59 PM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
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PickYourShots.com
  I guess that means we can all go out and actually shoot something new instead of playing with the refresh button! Now if I can just remember where I put my car..


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7/22/2006 5:34:16 AM

 
Charlene Bayerle
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/9/2003
PictureThisbyChar.com
  Hi Kerry
What is the monthly theme going to be for August?


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7/22/2006 6:19:37 AM

 
Barbara Helgason
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/4/2004
  Thank you for the update, it is very much appreciated.


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7/22/2006 6:49:55 AM

 
Shelly A. Van Camp
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2005
Contact Shelly
Shelly's Gallery
  Hi Kerry:
We all appreciate the update. Thank you!
Shelly


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7/22/2006 7:15:07 AM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Cathy, Carolyn, Charlene, Barbara and Shelly,
You're welcome, and thanks so much for the nice words and the support!!
Kerry

P.S. to Carolyn: Yes, a great idea :-)... and I hope you find your car! lol

P.S. to Charlene ... Hmmmmm, an excellent question! I shall find out, and post soon ... thanks for the reminder!!!


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7/22/2006 9:16:19 AM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hello again Everyone,
And here it is ... a verrrrry appropriate August theme (at least for around my home in Northern California, with a high of 110 degrees F. predicted today): Keep Cool

Thanks!
Kerry


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7/22/2006 10:28:12 AM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
 
 
 
Good theme!!


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7/22/2006 10:33:52 AM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Bob,
Yes, I agree: a "good theme" ... and as for your photo: terrific and fun!!!! :-) Thanks for sharing!
Kerry


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7/22/2006 10:45:22 AM

 
Diane Dupuis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2003
  Thanks for the update Kerry. I'm sorry to hear it's being postponed another 10 days though. I actually have a photo in the July contest which would be perfect for the August theme but I wouldn't want to re-submit it until I know it doesn't make it in July. We actually had a 10 day opportunity for resubs if we wanted. I know there are way too many entries to handle the contest in a week or two, but I find 4 weeks is a little bit long.
(Please don't strike me with the no more finalists for you for speaking out not in favour of our new policy!!!)
I still love BP and the people here - I just don't understand why it takes so long. I know there are several stages of the contest - and there are twice as many entries as when I started here a few years ago (when the finalists were announced by the middle of the month)...
Anyhow, hope you're all having a good day.
D.


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7/22/2006 12:26:40 PM

 
Jim Miotke
BetterPhoto Member
BetterPhotoJim.com
Owner, BetterPhoto.com, Inc.
  Diane, you can speak your mind but, in response, let me just ask, Have you ever tried to carefully consider almost 30,000 photos? It takes a lot of time.

Sure, we could cut corners by letting a computer program randomly select images to go into the finalists (several other contests do just this, but we would never allow this at BetterPhoto).

The other option is to send us lots of money so we can hire more expert photographers to judge :)

We also accept Ben & Jerry's :)

(Bob, I love your photo.)

Thanks for all of your support, BPer's. "Keep cool" and have a great time with our fun contest. I wish you the best and hope each and every one of you WIN!


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7/22/2006 12:46:21 PM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
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PickYourShots.com
  HEY! You could get a lot of us to work for ice cream about now! It's been 108 on my front porch this week! I could even be bribed with CHEAP ice cream!


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7/22/2006 1:30:28 PM

 
Jim Miotke
BetterPhoto Member
BetterPhotoJim.com
Owner, BetterPhoto.com, Inc.
  ;)


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7/22/2006 1:35:05 PM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  I'm also enjoying/appreciating the personal touch......Kerry/Jim responding!

108? The dog wouldn't be getting anywhere near the icecream at that temperature!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I did a little simple math...at 25K entries, 30 secs given to each photo, it would take 8.6 days for one person to look at all the photos...not including eating/sleeping/pit stops/technical malfunctions/mouse finger massage/etc....


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7/22/2006 2:04:43 PM

 
Erin Tyler
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/30/2005
  ROFL! Hey I'm willing to share my ice cream. The hilarious thing is I don't even remember what I submitted for last month's contest. Hopefully I didn't delete it, lol.

Have fun, all!


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7/22/2006 2:15:32 PM

 
Kay Beausoleil
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/31/2004
KayBeausoleilPhotography.com
  Bob, having been to many public judgings, I can't imagine anyone, even the BP judges, taking 30 secs a photo. From what I've seen, anything over 5 seconds is long in a first round. Sorting out prizes and mentions in the stuff that survives is longer and gets longer at the top, but I doubt it's anywhere near an average of 30 seconds. Unless Ben and Jerry's has an overriding influence ...


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7/22/2006 2:55:19 PM

 
Diane Dupuis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2003
  Hey Jim, thanks for the response. No I haven't tried judging that many photos. Or any for that matter. But I would hope that with the extra traffic the contest has brought - it has also brought in more revenue - and hopefully one day enough to hire some extra help to do the judging...
I know it was great of you guys to offer the free galleries - and I'm sure it's brought a lot more pics to the contest - but as a paying customer - don't kill me for suggesting this - but maybe there should be some kind of limit of entries on the non-paying BPers? Or maybe the galleries could be free for the first month or two or three and then they'd have to buy a premium gallery (which is a steal by the way at the price you're offering...!!!)
Anyhow - did someone mention ice cream? Ben and Jerry's half baked perhaps!? YUM!


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7/22/2006 8:39:53 PM

 

BetterPhoto Member
  Thanks Kerry for the update! I'm glad I popped in over here. I was wondering what next month's theme was going to be. I really enjoyed the funny one. I'm fairly new so I didn't even realize this was unusal.

Love the dog with the Ben and Jerry's up there!


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7/22/2006 10:41:55 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  Diane, I think you may be opening a can of worms there ;) The Premium Gallery fee of $22/year, when factored against just the contest entries, works out to about 6 cents per photo entered (assuming you enter daily, as the maximum allowed to everyone.) Not too much more as a paying customer, compared to the 0 cents for a free gallery owner ;)
A bigger concern to me would be to continue that line of reasoning about paying customers vs. non-paying; it sets up the status system where paying is better than not paying, so by extension, paying more should be better than paying less. What do you do if you've paid $359 to BP for your own pro site, and you enter the contest regularly? Now, not only are all those free gallery entries inflating the numbers each month, but so are the Premium entries, who of course paid far less than the Pro folks! As a paying customer, the Pro's are the biggest per-customer revenue of them all; could BP also need to limit the Premium entries after awhile?
Also, regarding the photo you want to resubmit--I'm sure you realize you still can. You can submit it now (to July) and find out later if June's entry garnered an award. Or hold it to resubmit in August (to give the judges a month inbetween seeing it twice; I've encountered many folks here who suggest that 1 month delay on resubmits.) The worst that happens if you re-enter right now, would be that it shows up in July's entries for judging with a June badge on it already, and therefore you've "wasted" 1 daily July entry slot by repeating a winner. Although there is the chance it could garner a higher-level award on the resubmit...
Anyway, all this rambling is just my 2-cents worth, thinking out loud. (Or should I say 6 cents? ;) The extra 10 days wait for me is also mildly maddening (more in an obsessive kind of way than anything serious) but having it spelled out is so much better (in my view) than for BP to keep missing their 21st date, due to the growing volume of entries. I still worry that after awhile, those 10 days may not be enough buffer for the judges... when BP hits 50,000 entries per month, for instance, which would be a bit more than twice the amount in the contest when I joined 10 months ago!
(PS--the earlier comment that a judge would need 8.6 days I think is misleading; even more dramatic is assuming you allow a judge the role of a traditional employee, ie, working an average 8 hour day M-F, and if they spent those 8 hours JUST judging non-stop... 30,000 entries, even when accelerated to 15 seconds per image, requires the single judge to spend 15.6 work days getting through them!)
Good luck to everyone in the June entries!!


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7/23/2006 4:29:12 AM

 
Dorothy Neumann
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/21/2004
  WTG DDK! I don't care how many entries they get, people deserve the results quicker than 30 (or 31 days, depending on the month). You can't persuade me that BP isn't making enough money to hire enough judges. Not with all those people buying premium galleries, websites, courses, books etc. Every other line at BP is a pitch to buy something.


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7/23/2006 4:58:49 AM

 
Diane Dupuis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2003
  Thanks Dorothy. Hey Chris - even before BP offered free galleries - you didn't have to be a paying member to be able to enter the contest. You just had to sign up with an e-mail address and you could enter a pic a day for free. That's always been the way at BP. The main disadvantage was you couldn't find your pic before except in the contest entries. I guess it's just me who figures that having the free galleries it has brought more people to the site (which is good of course) but also brought a lot more pics to the contest - not all good unfortunately - almost doubling the number of entries from 2 years ago.


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7/23/2006 5:27:05 AM

 

BetterPhoto Member
  Thanks a million for the notification, and good luck with such an undertaking. All the best!!)


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7/23/2006 7:24:22 AM

 
Mike Rubin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/15/2004
  So it takes a month, What's the rush. It's not like any of us are leaving anytime soon. I don't know of any other contests which receive a lot of entries that are any quicker.
Didn't mama ever tell you to be patient. Now just go out and shoot something. ;)


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7/23/2006 9:28:35 AM

 
Tamera S. Phillips
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/28/2005
  As soon as I read this I decided I would take a drive to Napa Valley and take new pictures. Little did I know it would be 106 by noon...Keep Cool is perfect for August. Where in No California are you at Kerry? I just moved to Foster City from the Seattle area where they too are breaking records with near 100 degree heat!


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7/23/2006 12:53:59 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Everyone,
Oh, wow, send some Ben & Jerry's my way! :-)

Hi Tamera,
Ah, yes, everywhere in California seems to be breaking the heat records! I live out in the country right outside Sacramento ... and we're looking at another 110-degree day today :-( So, in the words of the August contest theme: Keep cool! :-)
Kerry


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7/23/2006 3:24:01 PM

 
Kerby Pfrangle
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/19/2005
Contact Kerby
Kerby's Gallery
  It has been in the 90's here in Wyoming and I thought that was hot.

Kerry I am glad I am not in Sacramento where it 110. That is way to hot.

Stay inside where it is cool.

Kerby


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7/23/2006 3:29:05 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Kerby,
Nice hearing from you! 90s in WY. is definitely hot too ... but, yes, 110 is waaaaay too toasty. Thanks for the note!
Kerry


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7/23/2006 3:30:25 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  Tamera, the trick to summer heat in Napa is just to pick one winery and stay in their air-conditioned tasting room all day. Granted, they don't like loitering, so you may have to drink a wee bit of wine... I suggest Vine Cliff or Beaulieu! ;)


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7/23/2006 6:25:36 PM

 
Patrycja Adamowska
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/12/2006
  It is great I just read this post. :-)Couse I was checking every day to see winners and finalist from last month.(I still will be comming every day just to see new photos entry or read some discusions!).But How great that now there will be some date to announce winners. [pick me!pick me!] hahahaha ;-) stay cool all!


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7/23/2006 6:41:43 PM

 
VISHVAJIT JUIKAR
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/25/2004
Contact VISHVAJIT
VISHVAJIT's Gallery
LoveTheNature.com
  Today is the day to see the list of Finalist? or we need to wait some more ???


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7/23/2006 11:10:36 PM

 
Joyce Baldassarre
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/9/2003
  Thank you for letting us know! I appreciate the info and will be patient (chewing acrylic nails). lol


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7/24/2006 3:53:48 AM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  I read through this and it really makes no difference to me if the results come out on the 21st or the end of the month. I had no idea that there were over 30 000 entries and goodness knows how long they take to go thorugh. I would hate to see the format changed to limit pictures for certain categories or for people who use free space - I must clarify here that I have a paid for gallery - or for a pc to randomly choose finalists. I think we are all here to learn and to enjoy the lovely pictures. Most of us went the "free" route when we first found this site and then upgraded to a Premium Gallery. If there had a been a million restrictions on those free sites maybe some of us would not have stuck around and become regulars.


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7/24/2006 4:34:32 AM

 
Tamera S. Phillips
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/28/2005
  Thanks for the suggestion Chris. I did manage to loiter for quite some time at Beringer which is my favorite winery so far. I moved around the grounds a bit, drank some wine and sat in the shade. I even ended up joining the wine club!! I'll have to take a look at the two places you suggested though. I don't think I saw either of them.


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7/24/2006 7:31:48 AM

 
Marie Fields
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/28/2004
Contact Marie
Marie's Gallery
  Thanks for notifying us of the delay. It's so nice to be informed about what's going on. I am so disappointed to hear that the "turn around" time is going to be even longer. I do realize that there are 30,000 entries to go through but just wish there was some way to get the results out quicker. The contest was so much more fun to participate in a couple of years ago. I guess everything changes and as it gets bigger and bigger if the judging system isn't able to adapt then the time frame will just keep getting prolonged... 30 days for results is a long time and for the images submitted at the beginning of the month, it's almost 2 months before you get any feedback ...

Diane, I think your idea sounds like a viable option... at least a springboard for ideas...(and I know what you mean about that 10 day window for resubmitting as well.)

There has to be a way to either reduce the number of entries or increase the number of judges! :) How much ice cream should we send? lol!


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7/24/2006 7:56:56 AM

 
Barbara Helgason
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/4/2004
  I for one would love to see the number of entries reduced. I enjoy going through the most recent entries and commenting on the ones I like but sometimes the sheer number of snapshots (great for the family album, but not really contest material), are a little overwhelming.


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7/24/2006 9:49:58 AM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  I know what you mean about snapshots but a lot of us here are beginners and the only way we learn is by entering and comparing in situations like this. Something that may be a snapshot to you might be something I am proud of. I would hate it if BP were to turn into a "professional" site and I would probably stop coming here. This is a site with courses for all levels of photography and surely we should encourage everyone to compete and feel able to show their work. It really is the only way that you learn.


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7/24/2006 9:57:57 AM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  And exactly what is wrong with my family?!?!?!?!
It goes back to that clay ashtray I made in grade school...mom said it was the best clay ashtray she'd ever seen....the man at the corner clay ashtray store looked at it and threw it in the trash.
I entered "snapshots" when I first started at BP. Then I learned and grew. Now only half my entries are snapshots....I'm still learning...:-)
(There's a message in there somewhere, I think)
Bob


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7/24/2006 9:58:13 AM

 
Don Williams
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/6/2004
  I guess I'm a little more dense than others. What is the difference between 30 days ending on the 22-26th or on the end of the month? Thirty days is thirty days (except for this transition period). I think the key is simply for the managers of the contest to keep its entrant/members updated as to the status of the announcement. Look at the postings of "relief" from that simple act of communication.


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7/24/2006 9:58:20 AM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  Ya beat me by 16 seconds, Sarah....:-)

Bob


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7/24/2006 10:00:59 AM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  Great minds think alike .............. and fools seldom differ?


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7/24/2006 10:06:26 AM

 
Marie Fields
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/28/2004
Contact Marie
Marie's Gallery
  D. Byron, it's not just 30 days...

When I first entered the contest the finalists were announced on the 12th of the month...then it got moved to the 15th, then the 21st, and now the 31st. So initially if I had entered a photo into the contest on the first day of the month it would have been about 42 days until notification if it had made finalist...now that has been extended to 60 days or so... and as the contest continues to get bigger, the time will undoubtedly be extended again. It's just a very long time to wait for feedback is all I'm saying and I just wish it didn't have to be that way. I wouldn't mind even paying an entry fee (I know... everybody wants the contest to stay free) but if it would improve the quality and eliminate the overwhelming burden on the judges then maybe that's what we should do....?


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7/24/2006 10:15:26 AM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  After reading this I am starting to think that I have come to a site without understanding who it was aimed at. I found this site and came here as it enabled me to learn and to enter a monthly contest for fun. It is cost effective and there seemed to be all levels here. After rereading this thread it appears that this is probably not the case as a number of members are looking for more than that. Is this infact a professional site. If so then it would probably be fair to assume that a payment should be charged for entries and the competition could be run along strict rules. I was under the impression that this was a fun site and that it encouraged people of all levels to pick up their camera and shoot. If I do have it wrong than I am probably in the wrong place for someone like me. Charging for competitions will drive a lot of folk away.

I think this site is very lucky to have people who sit down and go through all the entries and waiting 30 days after the close of the contest is a small price to pay. If any of you were to enter a magazine contest you would wait a lot longer than that for results.


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7/24/2006 10:27:22 AM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  I know I'll sound like the defender of the status quo, but I don't like the idea of a contest entry fee. I like the "democratic" feel of a free-to-all contest, and I can already picture the discussion threads from unhappy entrants who pay that fee, but then fail to ever receive a Finalist. (For some folks, it would be so easy to complain that your fee should entitle you to SOMETHING someday... vs. taking a hard critical look at what you're submitting. Even as a free contest, there are people here today who finally "give up" on the contest (in anger!) because they've entered many months in a row with nothing awarded to them.)
It seems to be a simple matter of resources; from what I've learned, BP's employees are not hired in a solely-judging capacity. All the judges in the process have some other BP job, and perhaps jobs outside of BP, not to mention families, and their own interests in photography. Yet I personally wouldn't want to see any change in the judging process that would reduce the *quality* of judging. (That idea mentioned earlier of a computer program... yuck!) I'd much rather know a person (with a connection to photography) is evaluating my entry.
As I'm a fairly constant entrant in the contest, the new timeline doesn't really phase me... D Byron's comment of "30 days is 30 days" is right... before this change, the announcement date was scheduled for the 21st... it is then 30 (or 31) days until the NEXT scheduled "21st announcements"... now, it will be 8/31 for the July winners announcements, and then, 30 days later, 9/30 for the August winners announcement. So the wait between monthly announcements is not changing. Just the "I want to know about last month's results asap" time frame is changing, in terms of the user community. And yes, it could likely need to change again, if the contest keeps this growth rate... however, anything over a month of evaluation time will bring new challenges to the judges, as they would be wrapping up judging on 1 contest, when the period of judging the next contest goes active! If staff cannot be expanded at BP to increase the judging pool, and the alternative is entry limitation of some sort, I would hope to see it take the form of a single limit applicable to all users... such as no contest entry on weekends (or some other 2-day window); at about 800/day, that would cut down 8,000 entries in July!) It would only be a stopgap measure; the Mon-Fri numbers would still grow. But it seems like a fair limitation, applied universally. (But I already know there will be someone who says "I can only access the internet on Saturday afternoons!" So perhaps rephrasing it to 20 entries per month, per user, submitted over a calendar month. ;)


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7/24/2006 10:42:55 AM

 
Diane Dupuis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2003
  Lots of good discussion going on. We've rehashed most of it over and over again in past Q&A threads though.
Sarah - as for your comments about beginners and pros (and everything in between) being allowed to compete together - I don't have a problem. Gee we've all been there! But from experience I can tell you that you learn way more from practicing, getting help from other photographers (by asking questions), search out photography chat groups (ask Kara Hendricks - she's the moderator of one that has many BP photographers) and studying about photography, check out some books in your local library - and check out free internet sites (google anything you'd like and you'll find at least 10 sites with great info) and last but not least taking courses. Then go out and practice some more!
Entering the contest may get you a few comments on your work - but also from experience most people will give you a "good job" rather than a real critique.
OK - gotta go jump in the lake now...


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7/24/2006 11:02:53 AM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  Where have I been??? LOL

Christopher said, "Even as a free contest, there are people here today who finally "give up" on the contest (in anger!) because they've entered many months in a row with nothing awarded to them.)"

I would hate this site to become as many of our public school systems. If kids can not cut it these days they pass anyway. I think they call it Outcome Based Education??? When I started entering here I had a lot to learn and I've learned a lot, but I didn't learn it by getting mad and quitting. I am sorry if this sounds unkind but not everyone has the talent or skill with a camera to win. Anyone entering for a couple of months and not going anywhere in the contest needs to evaluate why this might be so and maybe take a course or two (or get some books). I don't seem to have what it takes to win in the N&L category with a scenic. Does this make me want to quit? No, it makes me want to try harder and read more books. Sorry, I can't afford a course or I'd try that :o)! I get a little tired of so many really horrid "snapshots" I see entered on a daily basis. Aren't people studying the craft of photography at all??? Sure I have duds and even enter a few :o) but when I put the camera up to my face it's usually on a tripod and I'm doing my best to compose through the viewfinder before releasing the shutter.

As for limits...I just have this to say :P! Charging to enter???? Digital Photography Contest charged and they aren't around anymore. I'd like to see BP around for a good long while!

Where's the ice cream?????


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7/24/2006 11:08:24 AM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  Ask my dog! I can't find the ice cream anywhere...:-)

Bob


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7/24/2006 11:11:55 AM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
Carolyn 's Gallery
PickYourShots.com
  I agree with the staus quo group. We are here to learn, and we do.(Well, most of us do). I'm sure many of you started out as bad as I did and keep improving just by constant exposure to good work. If I want to know how something is done, I ask and usually find out sooner or later. You can learn a lot just by reading the QnA and the articles section regularly. I think a lot of the snapshots get put in the contest just because that's the only place that they will be easy to find. I'm guilty of that myself on occasion. It doesn't do much good to complain about the finals, they get done when they get done, and I doubt if that will change no matter what is said here.


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7/24/2006 11:14:19 AM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  Carolyn, We all enter shots from time to time we simply want to share. I think everyone here knows what a horrid photo looks like and none of yours ever fits that category ;)!


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7/24/2006 11:22:28 AM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
Carolyn 's Gallery
PickYourShots.com
  Well, they used to, and that's my point!


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7/24/2006 11:24:15 AM

 
Tamera S. Phillips
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/28/2005
  If I have a snapshot type photo to share then I do not enter it into the contest. You are right Sharon. Some of us are friends here and we like to share moments in our lives through pictures. I vote for no charging to enter the contest and would suggest patience. We can do it. I know it's hard but in my mind still worth the wait.

I'll take Chocolate Chip Cookie Dough~


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7/24/2006 11:38:51 AM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  Carolyn, I see you didn't get mad and quit :o)! They're looking good now!

The thing I was trying to point out is it doesn't do anyone any good if photos that do not meet any kind of criteria for excellence are awarded finalist status just so someone doesn't get mad and quit. Sure it's discouraging when you're passed over month after month. I went through that phase as well and who knows, I might again. They can't give finalists to everyone!

I bet Kerry is wondering how his announcement lead to "how to fix" the site LOL.


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7/24/2006 12:07:22 PM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  These "go where it may" discussions are fun every off and again. Great for occupying "that time of the month"...:-)

I'm off to the store...Kibble Sorbet anyone??


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7/24/2006 12:16:44 PM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
Carolyn 's Gallery
PickYourShots.com
  I didn't quit, but I sure did threaten to a lot! LOL.
Bring me some of that Kibble Sorbet! My dog says that sounds pretty darn good about now!


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7/24/2006 12:50:54 PM

 
Kerry Drager
BetterPhoto Member
Kerry's Photo Courses:
4-Week Short Course: Creative Close-ups
  Hi Sharon,
You made a reference to an announcement that I had made ... hmmmmmm, now I'm trying to remember just what that announcement was about :-)
Kerry


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7/24/2006 12:56:05 PM

 
Carolyn  M. Fletcher
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/6/2001
Contact Carolyn
Carolyn 's Gallery
PickYourShots.com
  There was an announcement? When?? Hmmm.


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7/24/2006 12:58:25 PM

 
Pamela Shane
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/4/2004
  I like the last day of the month idea -
I know we all get anxious; but the suspense is part of the contest fun for me. Sometimes I get a little bummed out if I don't get a finalist,
but @ 30,000 entries that's the way the cookie crumbles - it makes me even more motivated to improve my work. I have never wanted to quit because I didn't receive a finalist. I enjoy looking at other's photographic art, & learning. I think no matter how long, or what level one is at - we all learn something new everyday. I am just happy to have made friends on this site, who share the same obsessive passion for the art of photography.
Best of luck to all contestants!
:)


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7/24/2006 1:09:22 PM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  I think persevering in a contest is a nice goal to set. I dont see myself giving up soon. No one takes up an interest and expects to win or be a finalist in the learning stages. People who are that naive would not stick out the interest anyway.


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7/24/2006 1:37:19 PM

 
Rob Zuidema
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/19/2005
 
 
BetterPhoto.com Editor's Pick   Can somebody help me scratch?
Can somebody help me scratch?
© Rob Zuidema
Canon EOS Digital ...
 
 
21st or 31st...really doesn't matter to me...but I'm just itching to see the results. :-)


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7/24/2006 1:48:03 PM

 
Pamela Shane
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/4/2004
  LoL Rob! :)


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7/24/2006 2:21:47 PM

 
Bob Cournoyer
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2003
Contact Bob
Bob's Gallery
bobslens.com
  Good job, Rob! Did you get your inspiration from the Yoga channel?


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7/24/2006 2:41:23 PM

 
Judyann Plante
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2005
  I, too, sometimes wonder about the quality of some of the shots that are entered in the contest. But I doubt that the really "bad shots" are the major problem in judging. It would probably be quite easy to quickly discard them. I would think the bigger problem would be judging the number of really great photos that are entered each month. And to be quite honest seeing some of the not so good photos when I first visited the site was an encouragement for me to join because I felt there was a place for me here too, as a new photographer.

I would hate to see limitations put on the contest. The free contest, as well as a place to grow and learn, is what draws many of us to BP in the first place. I have learned so much in the few months I have been a member. Every time I think I have something good, someone posts a similar photo that just blows me away. Keeps me striving to improve. I don't know how anyone could look at some of the fantastic images on this site and be angry about not winning. Getting a finalist was the most amazing thing to me, considering the "competition."


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7/24/2006 3:21:52 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  I'm with you, Judyann! That first Finalist was a thrill that caught me by surprise! Now, I've started asking myself "what do I need to do, to take it to the next level?" (hehehe---a Second Place?!) Haven't found that answer yet, in my quest ;)
The "angry quitter" surprised me too... (they posted in a discussion thread here, back in Nov. or Dec., I believe.) I couldn't quite imagine letting a contest get so under your skin, but everyone is different, no?


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7/24/2006 3:27:33 PM

 
Mike Rubin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/15/2004
  How about a limit of 5 entries per month per member. And a waiting period of 2 months before you can enter an image again.


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7/24/2006 4:32:14 PM

 
Brendan Knell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/17/2005
  Mike, I think 5 entries a month, is a little unreasonable. Especiall since we can enter 30(31 sometimes) a month right now. Also, the waiting peroid, I don't know how they'd enforce that.


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7/24/2006 4:42:00 PM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  I think that limiting it so much would take a lot of fun out of it. If there are time frames and harsh limitations on the number of pictures you can put in people will forget to come here on a daily basis. If people can only enter 5 or ten pictures they will save their entering for the end of the month to make sure that they dont take anything better going forward. The current format means that you have an interest in coming to the site every day.

I must say that this discussion has take the edge off of the site for me personally and I will be reluctant to enter pictures as freely as I did before. I never realized that there were such strong feelings around this.


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7/24/2006 4:55:06 PM

 
Kerby Pfrangle
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/19/2005
Contact Kerby
Kerby's Gallery
  If anyone has an extra thirty seconds and want something different to do or your bored.

Go to Keshia's website

http://www.newfaces.com/krain

look on the left hand side where it says RATE ME and click on that.

Than please click on the TEN. Ten is the best.

It helps Keshia keep her page on the front page of the New Faces website.

You can only vote one time per computer. It takes about thirty seconds.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

Big THANK YOU to everyone that already helped her out.

Kerby and Keshia


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7/24/2006 4:56:50 PM

 
Marie Fields
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/28/2004
Contact Marie
Marie's Gallery
  Just a note for those new members who weren't here at the time... A while back when bp limited the number of entries to 10 per month there was such an uprising from the members that they removed the limit... (if you're interested in reading that discussion, just type in New Contest under the search and it should come up)...


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7/24/2006 5:06:28 PM

 
Marie Fields
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/28/2004
Contact Marie
Marie's Gallery
  ...actually if you type in 10 entries, the discussion I'm referring to comes up at the type of the list and is titled New Contest (7/04)


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7/24/2006 5:09:23 PM

 
KV Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/25/2005
  Doesn't matter to me if its the 21st or the 31st. Its still a differenc of just a few days for finalist posting and a few more for the winners. I haven't won anything so I don't hold my breathe for the winners, just happy for them all. All great photos but for me 30000 would make me cross eyed! lol I would like to see the site have more than 1 POTD to maybe 3 P'sOTD each day to take some of the suspense off the contest and give more attaboys during the month. Just a thought. I think people would just be thrilled with getting a judges comment once in a while. As far as ice cream, I will take Chocolate Marshmellow, 3 scoops (oink) please. :)


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7/24/2006 5:10:52 PM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  Sarah, there are strong feelings here at BP, but a lot of helpful advice when it's needed and friendly camaraderie amongst the members AND no one has cussed ;)! You shouldn't be too quick to pick up your toys and go home. It's a fun site. I'd miss it a lot if it wasn't around.


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7/24/2006 5:13:32 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  Sarah, you just said "I don't see myself giving up soon" and then not 4 hours later, "I will be reluctant to post pictures as freely as I did before"... I truly hope you're not saying that the contents of a long, rambling discussion thread have that much sway over you and your enjoyment of the site! I know the discussion threads have been a remarkable source of interest and education for me, and I know that is so for many others... some of the threads bring out attitudes in people, and a few very rare threads can get ugly--same as anywhere on the net. The near total majority are helpful or instructive or clarifying or funny or a mix. But if this thread has actually affected you that significantly, I think you have missed the underlying point of the actual website itself, which is to foster better photography in everyone, regardless of your present level. My advice; take away what you find useful, and skip over the rest... don't let any thread in the Forum (or messages on an image, for that matter) get under your skin.


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7/24/2006 5:17:42 PM

 
Brendan Knell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/17/2005
  Sarah, don't be discouraged, on what has been said. I don't think that we're talking about noivices, shots that they really like. What we're complaining about, is more good photographers, that enter 2nd rate photos, because they can enter 1 per day. These are ones that do have good photos, but choose to enter bad, or just decent shots, because they want to enter one every day, and don't have a good one right now.


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7/24/2006 5:21:13 PM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  Brendan, that happens too which brings me to another suggestion...a ten step program for BP junkies that can't start the day without entering a pic :D! I do this before having my breakfast LOL.


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7/24/2006 5:26:00 PM

 
Christopher Budny
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/3/2005
chrisbudny.com
  Sharon, you know I'm a charter member of that group, right there with you... I'm even guilty of Brendan's lament, sometimes. That can be the medical term for it... I'm suffering from "Brendan's Lament" ;)


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7/24/2006 5:29:03 PM

 
Pamela Shane
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/4/2004
  LoL Sharon - it's the first thing I do in the morning after pouring my first cup of coffee! :)


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7/24/2006 5:30:22 PM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  >>Sarah, you just said "I don't see myself giving up soon" and then not 4 hours later, "I will be reluctant to post pictures as freely as I did before"... <<

I meant that I dont see myself giving up on photography or entering competitions. I dont need to win to keep my interest in the hobby up. Hope that clarifies is!


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7/24/2006 5:40:27 PM

 
Brendan Knell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/17/2005
  I should be a member of that group! If I get on the internet, and try to type something into the address bar, and am not paying much attention, I start typing BP's address!


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7/24/2006 5:59:48 PM

 
Mike Rubin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/15/2004
  I did not know they tried a limit before.But if poeple cannot accept the delay as the contest grows then they should think about it again. I responded to this on the 23th and mentioned that we need to be patient. It's time to lighten up, Must of us have more important things in life to get worked up over. Along the lines of Kerby's suggestion, If you want something to do to take your mind off of this, Please visit my gallery and leave some Honest critiques, I can use the learning experience.


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7/24/2006 6:26:02 PM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  I only have 2mb of memory :o) so I may not be able to recall correctly but I thought when I first began entering there was a limit each month of 10. Wish I could remember what I did on the other 21 days!


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7/24/2006 6:31:47 PM

 
Brian Lobdell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/7/2005
Contact Brian
Brian's Gallery
  To echo Sharon earlier in this thread - "where have I been"? ...almost missed out on this ice-cream social debate! LOL!
I'm another amateur that timidly joined a year ago, and because of the open campus atmosphere and many motivating feedbacks, I have not only learned a tremedous amount, but I am encouraged and excited to KEEP learning!
I think a site of this size and scope will certainly not please everyone in all aspects, and yet it continues to thrive and grow! I think a lot of comments here are dealing with the BP growing pains, and hopefully the end result will reflect the mixture of criticism and suggestions from all you members.
I, too enjoy the "waiting", and feel that the judges are making considerable effort to really give the entries a fair look, so 30 days is not a big deal to me.
All that said, I would like to just mention that sometimes its easy (for me anyway) to focus on the contest and forget about all the other resources offered free through BP. I'm always amazed to see how much advice is willingly given by some of the pros, whether it be tips, or answers to questions from members. I think I could make a journal of all the techniques and advice I've tried to save in the newsletter issues, etc. (My email/links file is getting awfully big!)
So there's food (ice-cream) for thought, and I'm going to get mine before it melts... 102 today in Spokane!
Regards to you all!


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7/24/2006 7:14:42 PM

 
Kerby Pfrangle
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/19/2005
Contact Kerby
Kerby's Gallery
  Check your email the finalists are out.

Congratulations to all the finalists.

I am happy I got two.

Kerby


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7/24/2006 8:59:36 PM

 
VISHVAJIT JUIKAR
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/25/2004
Contact VISHVAJIT
VISHVAJIT's Gallery
LoveTheNature.com
  Congrats to all Finalist


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7/24/2006 9:01:06 PM

 
Diane Dupuis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/27/2003
  Congrats to all who made the top 769 out of 26,200 entries!! (or the top 3%!)


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7/24/2006 11:50:38 PM

 
Dr Silly
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/28/2004
  I for one love BP even if it take untill the end of the month for finalist. I have never been a finalist, but I do believe that my photo are getting better. There are some wonderful people out there that give of their self by helping others.

I am sorry to here how people think that you should limit people who have free gallerys. Maybe you should limit people who have not had a finalist in 6 months or more (like me) to only a small amount of up loads. I hope someone see my point.

I really don't think you should limit anyone. There are a lot of snapshots out there and we all started there.

Maybe the site should be for pro's only. Just kidding.

I don't mind not getting a finalist because I know there are people out there that like to see my photos.

I find this a fun place to be, and I think because people are in a rush to see how good they are, will just make it a place that is no longer fun.

Just let the people who run the site do their best and please keep it fun.

Doc



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7/25/2006 5:59:48 AM

 
Tonya R. Boles
BetterPhoto Member Since: 7/7/2004
  I like it just the way it is...You shouldn't put limits on those that might be able to pay for a gallery, just like you wouldn't put a limit on those that have a gallery full of wins or finalists...Neither would be fair...

Keep up the good work everyone. BP, thanks for a great place to hang out ....


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7/25/2006 8:26:26 AM

 
Diana Child
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/27/2006
  Alright, after careful consideration (3 whole minutes) and a thorough examination of the facts (I think I read 25%) I'm ready to throw my two cents in (As long as they haven't voted the penny out yet)...

First (and most importantly) Homemade Peach Ice Cream is being served at my house tonight... If you can't make it... More for me!

Second - I have never recieved a finalist. I don't know if the judges have ever even seen any of my entries. It would be nice to have a standard form statement go with each entry (like they do with stock photos - too blurry, lacks composition, ect.) These comments have helped me grow. It's true that I have stopped entering much at BP. Not because I want a prize handed to me for participating, but because I realized... It doesn't matter that much to me. I enjoy photography for photography's sake... I can't compete with the professionals right now, so I'm not going to waste my time or the judges with photos that just aren't up to par, especially since, as I said, I have no idea if they've even been looked at. With as many photos as they have to review (don't envy them) I can appreciate that they can't always catch every photo.

Third - I think it would be a mistake to base the contest on who pays... All you get is the same mix of good and bad but now your limiting it to those who can afford to be good or bad. I have a premium gallery. I use it to my advantage to display what I want for family, friends and the occasional sales. (Mouse pads have become popular)

Please remember... These judges have a LOT more to do than look at contest pictures all day. They are photographers. They're itching to be out snapping thier little hearts out, same as us. It shouldn't matter WHEN the contest finalist comes out. I don't think anyone here can honestly say that knowing if they have a finalist or winner is the most important thing in their lives. If it's fun to enter the contest, let it be fun... Don't make it your entire reason for taking that shot though. Pictures are memories.... Make them good ones...

(Ooops, tripped getting off the soap box... Hope no one got a shot of that)


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7/25/2006 1:15:59 PM

 
Dr Silly
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/28/2004
  Your so funny Diana. Time to move to Winter Haven so you can join the clown assocation.

Doc


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7/25/2006 1:20:50 PM

 
Diana Child
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/27/2006
  Find me a good paying job, get me all the chocolate I can eat and I'm there Doc! Now go bump a nose for me. :)


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7/25/2006 1:27:29 PM

 
Sharon  Day
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/27/2004
  "I enjoy photography for photography's sake... I can't compete with the professionals right now, so I'm not going to waste my time or the judges with photos that just aren't up to par..."

Diana, I would imagine most of the people who DO place and win here at BP are NOT professionals. I think everyone here is on a level playing field in that regard and I do believe that each photo DOES get looked at. I like to read the gallery bios and not too many claim to be making money from photography. Most say they just enjoy it as a hobby. I could name names of top winners here that I know aren't making money from it so don't let that discourage you!


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7/25/2006 1:41:57 PM

 
Diana Child
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/27/2006
  Sharon, I appreciate the encouraging words, and if the contests were truely important to me, then I would keep entering. I just honestly don't care enough about the prestige of the awards to worry with it. Several people have told me that I would do much better if I used photoshop to edit my photos. I'm just not ready to spend more time "fixing" my photos than I do taking them. Although many of the winners aren't professional in practice most are capable of going that direction if they have the desire. I'm not discouraged. I've just stopped taking photos based on what judges on one site prefer and returned to taking photos based on what I prefer. :)

(Darn it... Someone PLEASE fix that soap box)


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7/25/2006 2:04:53 PM

 
Jagadeesh Andrew Owens   I couldn't read all that up there before responding and it may have already been said:

BOTTOM LINE: IT'S A FREE CONTEST. QUIT YOUR BITCHING.

Do we pay ANYTHING to submit our images to the contest? NOPE.

As soon as BP starts making us pay a buck an entry, then we'll have every right to complain, but for now, everybody complaining is just SOL.

You're gonna piss them off and then THERE WILL BE NO CONTEST.

Don't ruin it for us who are patient and realize that they could be charging PER ENTRY or that there could be no contest at all.


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7/26/2006 10:05:50 AM

 
Sarah J. Thexton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/18/2006
  Well put!


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7/26/2006 10:12:16 AM

 
Diana Child
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/27/2006
  Sipho, Although I agree with your sentiment wholeheartedly, please remember that this is a family oriented site. Your opinion could have been expressed as eloquently without the cursing. That is just as likely to anger the administrators and get the offender removed from the board. We don't want to be deprived from seeing your awesome shots simply because of what I'm sure was a series of typos... I'm sure you meant "Quit your griping or complaining" and "You're going to get them angry." :)

(Boy that fall from the soap box is getting more painful every single time)


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7/26/2006 10:23:04 AM

 
Jagadeesh Andrew Owens   LOL! Sorry for any offense, Diana and/or others. I've never been one to mince words. I seriously doubt, though, that children are reading these threads, and if they are, then they've probably used worse language! Have you HEARD kids today??


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7/26/2006 10:29:33 AM

 
Diana Child
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/27/2006
  As a matter of fact, I have heard a few... My son is thirteen. I've embarrassed him more than once by letting his friends know that I have a nice tasty bar of LAVA soap handy (worst tasting I could find). Strangely enough, those kids same kids have never cursed again at my home and hang around more at my home than any of theirs... Go figure!


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7/26/2006 10:41:46 AM

 
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