 Aggie Villanueva |
Buying 1st Time Digital SLR Setup I am a total newbie. People buy my 10X13 prints even though they are from a 4 megapixel camera and taken on "auto." So I want to step into more professional prints to sell. I do plan to take courses, but I want to wait till I actually purchase the camera. I need advice of what camera & lenses & filters & other accesorries to I'll need. I shoot mostly outdoor landscapes & architecture, micro, try to capture birds in flight, black and white, and of course wedding and family photos (outdoor & indoors)which they sometimes purchase from me. I need professional quality prints at 11X14 or larger. Remember, I don't understand photography lingo yet (SOON). I've been saving for 1 1/2 years for this set up, so I'm serious about quality. I'll save another year if I have to for the right camera. I thank you all in advance for any advice offered.
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Irene Troy |
Hi Aggie and welcome! I’m a bit confused by your question. You call yourself a “newbie” and say that people are already buying your images – that’s not really a newbie; however, if you are serious about photography and want a really good camera that will produce good images, my new camera, a Canon 5D is definitely worth the cost. But, it is also a $3000 camera and that is for the body alone – no lens. This is a terrific camera that has got rave reviews from all over, but, it is a lot of camera and if you are really new it may be a bit overwhelming. Keep in mind that regardless of how much you spend or what brand camera/lens you purchase it is the person behind the lens that makes or breaks the final image! No matter how expensive the camera or lens; no matter how great the optics; ultimately, it comes down to what you know and how you can apply your knowledge.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Hi Irene I've taken photos all my adult life with good results, but I'm just checking into my 1st digital SLR. Everything I read about them is like greek. I've never used any setting but auto, so I feel like a complete newbie to real photography. What you said is so true about the person behind the lens, or having a "photographers eye." I have a few photos in my gallery here at BP. Would you mind having a look and letting me know if you think I can master true photography. I don't want to just waste my money if I don't have what it takes. Thanks for taking the time to write.
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Brendan Knell |
If 3000$ is a little much for you, Cannon's Rebel XT is about 800-900$, and the new 30D is about 1500$. From what I've heard, they're all pretty good cameras. Also, if you're getting good 10x13's off of a 4MP point & shoot(P&S), you should be able to get good ones off of any of these three.
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Brendan Knell |
Hey Aggie, we must have been typing at the same time. So to your new question, yes, I think you've got what it takes. I think that if you bought a DSLR, and started using manual controls, your photos would definately improve. Yes, yes, I know it's not just the camera, but there really is only so much you can do in auto. You've said that everything you've read about DSLRs is like Greek. So, why don't you tell us specifically what you're confused about. Then I'm sure someone can help you.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Thank you Brendon, Well, I'm thoroughly confused about lenses, filters, tripods, remotes to snap the shots. I take all kinds of ourdoor shots (landscapes, architecture, wildlife, birds in flight, macros, and of course people portraits and candid shots. I know I need a zoom that will bring me right into the next mountain range to snap that quail of the tree limb. Plus filters that get rid of that awful white out of mid day New Mexico sun, plus wide angle (I think that's what it's called when you want to fit more of that distant mountain into the shot). And of course a tripod and remote. And camera packs and gigabytes worth of memory cards, and.... From what I've read this is all just my basic setup to get professional quality photos in LARGE prints. But when I shop around online for the camera and all it's components I get completely confused. They all sound great. I think I need 10 megapixels, but they are all over $2,000. Then I can't buy all the lenses & filters and such to use it properly. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk with me about it.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Oh yeah, Brendon, I'm going to do a search for the 2 lesser expensive cameras you mentioned right now. Thanks again.
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Bob Chance |
Hi Aggie and welcome: First of all, let me say this. If people are already buying your prints, then you already have the 'eye' for artistic photography, even if you aren't fully familiar with the technical aspects.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Thank you Bob, I am such a newbie. When you talked about the 17-85mm lens, is that a zoom lens. And does the higher # (the 85) mean it zooms farther. I need to zoom as far as possible. And are the macro lenses separate? And yes, I do a lot of serious cropping. I was thinking a 10 megapixel would be enough, Do you think I need the 12.5? That one is out of my price range. I could spend $2500 but that needs to include my zoom lens, and macro lens, filter (what kind of basic filters will I need?), tripod, remote, a 2 gigabyte memory card and huge camera case. I'm sorry it sounds like I'm dumping 500 questions on you all. I really appreciate your feed back. Thank again.
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Brendan Knell |
Yes, the 17-85mm is a zoom lens, because it can change focal lengths. And yes, the higher the number, the farther it will zoom. I think that macro lenses are usually seperate. To tell you the truth, 2.5MP really won't make that much of a difference. What will, between these is that the 5D has a full frame sensor, and the Rebel and 30D don't. A full frame sensor, means that the sensor(like the film), is the same size as the film in a 35mm camera. I personally don't think that you really need the 5D just yet. The 30D should give you excellent results. The only problems I can see with it, is if you crop off half or over half of the image. So to some of your other questions. Filters: A polarizer will help get rid of white skies. But make sure that you get a circular polarizer, and not a linear one. Because the old linear ones screw up the autofocus on your camera. Another good filter if you want to do the silky effect on flowing water, is a Neutral Density filter. This cuts out the light, and lets you get a slower shutter speed. Another good one for landscapes is a graduated nuetral density. This helps to darken sky when it is brighter than the ground. On tripods, Bogen/Manfrotto is a good one, but their base price is about 100$. So another one is Quantaray(this is what I've got). I think this is Inkleys brand, so you've got to go there. Remotes: these help reduce the movements of your finger pressing the shutter release. I personally don't have one, and think that they are not something that you need to worry about right now. They're most helpfull in macro and long exposure. An alternative, is to use your self timer. You have to wait the 10 or so seconds, but it does the job.
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Mike Rubin |
Welcom to BP! I took a look at your gallery. You have the "eye". All the above camera suggestions are good. If you want to get a basic understanding before you can take courses I would reccommend the book "Understanding Exposure" by Bryan Peterson, published by Amphoto. It is probably the best book out on the subject. He also wrote "Learning to See Creativley" which is also excellent.
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Brendan Knell |
While on the subject of books, Jim Miotke's book is supposed to be very good. For the life of me, I can't remember what it's called! And I'm too lazy to look it up.
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Amy JACKSON |
Aggie, Hi! I just bought the Canon 30D a couple of months ago. I am really enjoying it. I bought it with the 18-55 lens but I also have a 28-105, 75-300 and 50mm macro lens. Best of luck to you!! Amy
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Aggie Villanueva |
Thank you Mike, I have been checking out some books on basic digital slr photography. I will definitely check into the ones you suggested.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Hi Amy. That camera has been recommended to me more than once. Thanks for your input.
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Oliver Anderson |
Buy Canon 30D, Canon17-40L, 70-200 2.8IS w.1.4X, 50MM 1.4 and 100MM Macro with tripod and good ballhead. The camera is very good and the lenses will move up to a better camera as you progress.
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Bob Chance |
Yes Aggie, your questoin in regards to the 17-85mm has already been answered. But keep in mind, that lens is an EF-S lens and will not work on the 5D or the 30D, which are both full frame. The EF-S lenses will only work on cameras utilizing the APS-C sensor which right now I beleive are the Rebel XT and the 20D. There might be a third, but I don't know off hand. If you do a lot of cropping, then the smaller sensor would be more of a help than a hinderence to you. In short, the difference between a full frame sensor and the smaller APS-C sensor is like taking a 5x7 photo and putting it in a 4x6 frame. This is why the focal length multiplier. It doesn't actually multiply the magnification of the lens, but because you're not captureing the full image circle the lens is designed for, it's like cropping in the camera. As far as macros. If you are unsure about which camera to get, and even if you do get an XT or 20D, I would still go for the 100mm macro, which is an EF lens and will work on the entire Canon camera line. You might buy an APS-C camera now, but in the future you might up grade to full frame. That lens would work on both, unlike the 60mm macro which is an EF-S lens. The 50mm macro is an EF lens and will work on all models, however, it only gives you 1/2 life size without the optional converter. By the time you buy the two, you might as well buy the 100mm which gives you lifesize without the need for a converter.
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Brendan Knell |
"...on the 5D or the 30D, which are both full frame." Bob, I just checked, and the 30D does not have a full frame sensor. It has the APS-C sensor.
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Bob Chance |
Thank you Brenda. My mistake. You are correct. I had forgotten the 30D is more or less an upgrade of the 20D and it does use the same sensor and digic II processor chip. Thank you for the correction. Too many camera models to keep track of. LOL!!!
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Brendan Knell |
I know what you mean Bob, there's tons of cameras! I've gotten features mixed up plenty of times!
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Aggie Villanueva |
That's it exactly, Bob After researching all these cameras I've found on the market, especially when I don't understand what the terms mean, my mind is just circling and ending up in the same as the beginning--not knowing which camera is best for me. But all your advice is so helpful. At least when I'm ready to purchase I can print out this message board and take it to the dealer so he can understand me and my camera need. From all of your input, I'm getting that I should buy a Canon, and one with lenses that will fit any future upgrade. Am I right? Thanks you all so much for the help. I will certainly use it.
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Bob Chance |
Yes Aggie, that would be my suggestion. Even if you went with the 20D, which is an awesome camera in itself, you may at some point later on want something with more megapixels, which usually means a full frame DSLR. If you have even the slightest inkling that you may do that, then don't waste money on lenses that won't operate on those cameras. Seeing how this would already be a major upgrade from your present camera, I would opt for the 20D. The lower cost of the body would allow you to put more money to additoinal lenses and accessories. Then later on, if you feel you need to upgrade, then do so. But if you're like most of us, the thought of taking a mortgage out to buy a camera body? The 30D does offer some refinements over the 20D. But this is something you would have to evaluate for yourself and decide if those refinements are worth the cost of another lens. Both models are 8.2 megapixels and use the same chip. The 30D does offer a spot metering mode, however, if you mainly shoot on auto now, then that kind of metering would only get you in trouble if you don't know how to properly use it. The 30D does offer a longer life shutter mechanism. However, I've read on other threads that it cost about $200 to have a shutter replaced vs. the $500 price difference between the two cameras. What kind of printer are you using for your 13x19" enlargements. I use the Epson R1800 and it gives me superb results. Even though I don't do many enlargements that size, because there isn't enough room in my house to hang all those prints. I use one frame and change the picture from time to time. For prints that size, I use Premium Glossy paper, water color paper and Velvet fine art paper, depending on the subject matter and the result I'm hoping to acheive. I'm just now testing out Epsons new Ultra Premium Glossy Paper in the full sheet size. Already I love it. It thicker. It has a higher brightness level for brighter whites and it is glossier(?) than their other paper.
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Steve Melamed |
I know that there are a ton of Canon folks here, but it doesn't hurt to suggest a Nikon set up. There also are plenty of third party lenses out there that are just as good as Canon or Nikon for half the price. I recently bought my start up kit. I bought the Nikon D70s, with the 18-70mm kit lens for about $1000. By the time I was finished buying the rest of my gear total was over $3000. So based on that I would say take 1/3 of the total amount you have and shop for a body. I would say stick to Canon or Nikon because they are the most popular and have the most accessories available. Go to the store and play with both. See which feels best to you. Honestly, you can spend days reading peoples opinions on why Canon is better or why Nikon is better and the end result is... they both take great pictures and there are pluses and minuses to both. This way you can build up your lens collection and invest in a better body further down the line. Hope this helps, good luck and happy shooting, Steve
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Oliver Anderson |
I did what Steve is suggesting with my 10D and lens collection then I started working out like 7 days a week got buffed and met a rich girl to buy my a 1Ds MarkII. Investing in a better body down the line can pay off...
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Aggie Villanueva |
Bob I get my 10X13 enlargements printed at WinkFlash on Matte paper. Matte covers up the graininess a little better than glossy. I love their quality, they have the cheapest prices anywhere, the most selection on sizes (especially for those expensive stretched canvas photos I love so much. I just put a filter in photoshop on a pix of my grandson that makes it look like an oil painting, then had it printed at 10X somting size for only $27.00. It's beautiful. I format my photo resolution for that size (10X13). If I have them printed at any other size I reformat the photo for that size only. I have a Hewlet Packerd Photosmart 8750 Pro. But when I print out anything at larger than 5X7 it's so grainy it's unuseable. But I've also noticed that when I print them that small it completely changes the color and darkens the photo outcome. I don't print many pix cause the ink costs so much. In a few more months when I have the money saved, my next problem, which I'm afraid none of you can help me with, is that I live in such a remote area in the northern New Mexico mountains. I'll have to make many trips I'm sure to the shop I buy from, and the closest city big enough to sell SLRs is Albuquerque, a two & 1/2 hour drive one way!!!! Thanks again.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Thank you Steve, Your figues on spending 1/3 of the total amount help me tremendously to know when I have enough saved to start seriously shopping.
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Aggie Villanueva |
Oliver, I like your sardonic humor. Trouble is, in this high poverty mountain area I live in, I AM the rich girl. And instead of buffing up, I've added pounds from sitting at the computer editing all those photos!!!! If any of you have some time to waste you can read about the life here in the northern New Mexico mountains. I wrote about 4 pages I've been working on in the years since I moved here. The website address is: www.freewebs.com/myaggie2/ Then on the side menu at the top click on "Life Here As I See It." Thanks again everybody for all your help. It is invaluable to me.
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Oliver Anderson |
Uuhhhh what sense of humor??? I was serious.JK
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Bob Chance |
Well Aggie, I guess I'll never complain about the drive I have to make anymore. Two years ago, I moved from Pa to wester NY. I was used to getting to stores in 20 minutes. Now, if I want a specialty store like cameras, or staples it's an hour drive.
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Aggie Villanueva |
I wanted to thank all of you who so freely gave your advice. It was soooo helpful. I finally got my set up. I ordered it through Adorama online. I got a Canon EOS 5D Digital SLR, with a Canon 580EX Speedlite flash, Canon EF 70-200 2.8l USM, a Canon EF 28-135 3.5/5.6 USM, a circular polarizer filter and UV protector filter, and a great bag and 2 gig card, battery charger and extra battery. Of course there's lots more basics I need, but that's a start. And of course I'm completely overwhelmed (I'll definitely be taking a class here as soon as I pay off the camera) I do have another question though. I have been studying all the manuals (even the flash does things I never imagined) but the $1,100.00 EF 70-200 zoom lens didn't have one. Could it be that simple to use? It's huge and complicated looking. And it'll take me a year to learn how to use my smaller lens, so it confused me when the super zoom lens had no manual. This all just arrived yesterday, and of course I was up all night playing with it. I even took pictures of it and sent all my friends and family shots of the "new arrival." I am so excited and feel so blessed to have it in my hands. And I wanted to thank you all again for being so giving and helpful.
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Oliver Anderson |
Yessss. Aggie, I'm sure you're a total newbie and people keep purchasing your photos. I would send the 2.8 back and get the 2.8IS because you do a lot of free hand photography and you're selling photos...trust me its worth the extra money and only a few people on this site earn money taking photos for a living...i have to sell my body...I'm very poor..JK
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Irene Troy |
Congratulations, Aggie, on your purchase! I certainly can relate to your excitement – when I got my 5D I could not stop going outside to capture images of just about everything I could find! Even now, after almost a year of ownership, I am still in love with the camera. Personally, I did not find the shift from the Konica-Minolta 7D to be that difficult. I had been using KM cameras for several years and yearning for this Canon, so I worried about the learning curve. Like you, I read all the books and did take the BP class on the camera; however, I found the best way to learn all the features was simply to make images. The great thing about digital is that you can try so many different things without having to pay to develop those so-so images or the ones you totally miss. I’m surprised that there was no manual with your 70-200mm lens. You might want to visit the Canon website and see if you can download one there. I do not have that particular lens, but all my other ones did come with a manual including my 400mm. Frankly, I rarely read these manuals; I know I should, but I usually learn best simply by doing. BTW: I find that I generally need a large capacity CF card such as a 4gb one because I shoot mostly in RAW. Just something else to think about! Good luck with your new “baby”. Irene
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Rom A.G. |
Cameras such as the Canon 30D or the new 50D are fine, but are expensive. The Olympus Evolt-500 comes with 2 lenses for $700. Better value for a beginner would be the Kodak P712, the Fuji S9500, Canon S3, the Lumix FZ30/FZ50.
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