 Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
First wedding job.... help needed! Hi everyone! I can't believe it but I got asked to do my first wedding today! YEAH FOR ME!!!! :) Of course I said I was interested, then I cringed inside hoping it wasn't some huge event! They were married by JP about two weeks ago, but are planning a small cermony in April. Second marriage for both, only bride, groom, best man & maid of honor and about 25 guests. Outside ceremony. I told her it would be my first wedding,she laughed & said that's fine, just keep it under a grand! :) I'm trying to decide what to charge, and how to come up with a checklist of poses to take. I'd like to comprise a spreadsheet that gives ideas of poses & shots and have them check off which they want and of course have them add any I forgot. I would also like to come up with some sort of agreement or contract (I've never used one before) for them to sign. If anyone has a sample contract or sample shot list I could copy or use, I would appreciate it. Or any guidance as to something they found on the web. Honestly, I haven't had time to search the web yet as my daughter had a competition today and I just got home. I was just excited and wanted to share my news with my fellow BPers and seek some guidance! So... any thoughts or advice for the rookie wedding photographer? :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Kevin Perrine |
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Kevin Perrine |
Sorry about the last message being cut off. Check out my gallery I've posted a pose list for weddings I will try to post a suggested contract just a general contract soon.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
For a 2nd wedding like that, they are not going to want to do the big wedding day thing. They've been there, done that, bought the t-shirt. All they want is some nice photos. So, just take them out after the ceremony, and do that for about 30 minutes. Don't do a pose list, this will bore them and probably not appeal to them at all. Just do what you want. 2nd weddings are usually very casual and very easy. My suggestion is to plan it out in your head what you want to do, but don't worry about having a shot list, in this case. For under $1k, I wouldn't give them much. Maybe just 100 'photographer select' 4x6's and a CD. That's what I would do for your first one.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Thanks Kevin, I'll head to your gallery in a second. :) Jerry, I was thinking of keeping it simple like you mentioned. I only thought of a photo list because she mentioned that she wants pics of the groom with his son.. and their parents, etc. I Just don't want to miss getting a shot of great-gram or something like that. Especially if I'm nervous! haha My thoughts were to charge $500-$600 for 4hours and 100 pics in a little album. And then maybe one or two free 5x7's. I figured if I did well I could increase my fees on the next one and just tell her that she's getting a discount as she is the first. I even thought of showing a higher fee on the invoice and then showing a discount. I know it will be relaxed, because she was surprised that I would be willing to come to the house while she's getting ready and the ceremony. She was initially only asking for after the ceremony. THanks again! I have until April to get prepared so I know I"ll be ready!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Kevin, thanks for the samples! I'll be busy this week! I actually found a bunch of lists on the web that I've copied to look at later. Even if I don't use it for this time, I'll be ready for the next! I'm just so excited that I get to do a wedding! I'm just starting so this will be so nice to have in my portfolio! Now all I need is a mom-to-be and then the newborns! I'll have the seniors because of my own son will be ready for them next year! Thanks again Kevin!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
Brenda, remember, nothing is free. The 5x7's you throw in aren't free. But, other than that, I think that's a good plan. A shot list might be good if she's requesting certain things.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
haha how true Jerry! Maybe with showing a discount on the invoice, I'll just leave it at the 100 pics in a proof album and be done. How do you typically do the proofs? What size and what type of album do you present them in? I've been looking for a few album suppliers but since I"ve never had to order something like that I wasn't sure who would be best?
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
Brenda, truth be told, I'm pretty lazy. I don't spend any time on proof products. In fact, for 100 proofs, I just hand them over in an envelope. For 300 or more, I get my boxes from Cypress ( www.cypressalbums.com ). They are pricey, but super nice. Run about $110 per box. Don't gag, they are that nice. I use them for my weddings. In your case, you can buy nice albums from Pottery Barn or whatever. Look at Pottery Barn, Crate&Barrel, and other places like that. Maybe Tagget too. It doesn't matter much for proofing. Final products, like finished albums, is a whole 'nuther issue.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Ahh... I guess that's what I was thinking is the finished albums... I should just do something simple on the proofs. I'll check out cypress. What size do you print for proofs Jerry? And who do you use? I've only got experience with mpix and I'm getting ready to try WHCC.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Jen |
Brenda, check this site out. It helped me A LOT! http://johnlind.tripod.com/wedding/
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
I offer 4x6 proof prints and get them from WHCC. I hear great things about MPIX too.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Jen, that site has alot of great info on it. I've bookmarked it to go over later. Jerry, I'm getting ready to send my 5 test files to WHCC so I'll try them and see how they compare with MPIX on quality & pricing. I have until April to pick between the two, so that will be good. :) How do you do the pricing on offering the cd? I know another bp'er who uses Proshow GOld to create a slideshow with the images Set to music. And then sells that. I think she charges $50 for the first one and then some price breaks for more of the same. I haven't tried that software yet or selling a cd of images.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Hey brenda!!! CONGRATS!! I've only done one wedding, with my 2nd booked for this coming July, it's also a "we got married quick, now we are doing a ceremony/reception". I have a nice simple, but comprehensive, contract at home, I'll email it to you tonight. (at work, don't have it with me) I have my prices on my site... since I'm new, they get a break! I'll slowly raise as I do more. I charge $50/hr, cost plus 20% on albums & pics. My 5-hr pkg w/ 150 proofs and photos on cd and 1 5x7 is $450. For my proofs I just use an album like you'd find in a high end dept store or craft store. They have great ones that are wedding themed & are cheap ($15-25) They hold 200 photos usually. I offer the Proshow slideshow separate for $125 (extra copies only $10) The time consuming part is putting it together, after that the exra copies I just burn. Everyone is different, you just have to figure out what your costs are, and what you want for your time. If I can earn enough to buy a new piece of equipment, I'm usually happy :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Denyse, that would be awesome. thanks! I'm going to try this week to compile a basic shot list. And I had already checked out your rates to try to get a feel for what to charge. I haven't purchased the proshow software yet maybe after this order I supposed to get today from a family I will do that. Like you, if I earn enough to buy a new toy, great! Otherwise, just enough to take hubby to dinner is cool too. I would really like to get that proshow though. For so many reasons. Hopefully you'll consider it a compliment if I copy your rates! haha
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Haha, yes of course, this site is all about sharing info & helping eachother. The shot list is a good idea, I studied one before the wedding I did and it really did help. The day is so hectic that it has to be engrained in your brain before hand :) The contract is on it's way to your email now!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
I'm in the same boat! I'm reading through all the posts about Weddings to get help and info. My in-laws recommended me. I've done floral work for weddings for years, so I may be doing both. These posts helped me to get a list and a contract. Thank you! Shelly
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Sabreena Konsdorf |
I have also booked my first wedding for June 2006. These posts were a god-send. THANK YOU ALL! I have always been interested in photography, but when a co-worker asked me to take some family photograph for their Christmas card, it has just snow-balled from there. I am looking for some honest critic on my work an would love to have you all visit my website: photosbysabreena.phanfare.com
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Debby A. Tabb |
Brenda, I sent you a email, twlling you how to order the CD's and also some pose list and contract. and had not heard back-I hope that email went through? let me know, thanks Debby
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Melissa L. Zavadil |
Hello Brenda! :) Congrats on your wedding! I think that a pose list is definately essential for your first wedding. I have found if I make a list for the 'formal' shots that works fine. But for the creative shots I try to use a montage of images that gets my creative edge going for the other shots. I have found that I really only have about 1/2 hour to get all the creative shots in so if you are 'reading' the shots it takes up soooo much time. I have formulated a contact sheet with creative wedding images that I can just glance at to get my next idea verses 'reading' -- since 'time' at a wedding seems to be such the issue. I would really be interested in looking at the contract mentioned above.... could someone email that to me :) :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Carrie H |
I too, would love to have a copy of the contract...if anyone could send it to my email carrie.hall@connors.ca I would really be grateful. I have taken 4 weddings last summer/fall... and have been asked to do three so far this summer... All by word of mouth.. I just purchased a digital rebel xt at Christmas time and have been loving it... Thanks for any help you can give me. Carrie
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Hi Carrie, how come no photos in your gallery? I love to see wedding images from fellow "newbies" :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
haha I did the same thing Denyse! I jumped to her gallery all excited! Share with us Carrie!!!! We want to marvel at your work. :) If you haven't gotten the contract yet, I can forward you what Debby sent me, I know she's a busy woman!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Well, I should know by Thursday if I'll be doing the wedding. I sent her a price list and she emailed me that she wasn't sure they could afford it but were going to discuss it. I'm meeting with her Thursday to talk about it. I've already decided I'm not compromising the price. I may offer her a third option (less money, less time, less product) but not sure. I'll let you all know. :) Thanks for all the help & ideas. I've been compiling other "shot" lists off the net and will be coming up with my version of it soon.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Congrats Brenda, just done my first (shadowing at my nieces wedding, but great experience - I was knackered at the end - you do about 40 million squats, well I do, to get different angles, on the bed looking down, on the grass, looking up - couldn't walk the next day!!!) I'm going to try post the check list I got - really handy. Check my gallery, have posted some pix. Doing my 2nd end March - also for free, but rather than give them a kettle/toaster/i'm doing the pix and a small album, so haven't worked out charges yet!! Need to start making money out of this, but at least they're great pix for the portfolio, and its the experience. Here go's ok, that didn't work///
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Wedding Shots – Not To Be Missed! Wedding Photography Shots Before the Ceremony Page 2/…
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
these shots in the order they will happen at your reception) Guests the photographer shouldn't miss: (provide your photographer with a seating chart so that he can easily identify them)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Sorry, had to break it up, but it's a great check list - and have fun!!! Look for the pix that are happening outside your viewfinder (the flower girl stealing the show in one of mine, the grooms face as the bride comes down the aisle, the mom/dads face/tears...!)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Carrie H |
Hi Brenda ~ I haven' t received the contract yet, thanks so much for offering to forward it to me. I will try to upload some wedding pics tonight after work. Photography isn't my fulltime job... Wish it were though... Maybe someday... I had trouble uploading lastnight, but I did manage to upload two (not of weddings though) Thanks for all of your great ideas and help. Carrie
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
...and this is what's wrong with wedding photography. how in hell are you going to make all that happen? what if it doesn't? do you force it? what if you promised your clients all those shots and you miss half of them? just relax and shoot moments that occur naturally. if you're on the ball, you'll get it all. weddings are not formula events. each is different. brides don't always look into a mirror in a way that is photographically nice. couples don't always want a big to-do with the formals. I have done some weddings where it's just one big group shot, a couple with the parents and we're done. try to break away from the formula. it is a unique event. find the thing that makes it different from all the others, that is what clients want to see. after you do a few you'll realize that all your sample weddings look the same. you'll quickly realize that brides want to see the uniqueness of each wedding. hone in on that. just like people are different in their personalities and characters, so are the weddings they host.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Debby A. Tabb |
Well this is where communication comes in. I have a short list witch I present of the Posed shots,at contract we discuss these will be the posed. and they have a Oppertunity to add and subtract what they would really like. Then I leave them with this short list and ask them to think about anything else thay would like to add and send it in the self addressed envelope I enclose with their balance payment 2 weeks before the event. Then I have that Long list of poses I would like to get, plus my candids. I DO NOT tell them about the long list-that is mine to work from, it helps me move through out the day grabbing my candids, an dgoing back as I have time to work from it. This has proven to be VERY successful for me. I don't ever present it, because I will not be held to it. So I agree and dis agree with Jerry. I belive you need to know what your couple is looking for and protect yourself. I had 2 weddings that were sure they DID NOT want any posed shots, HA! when all was done and we sat down to look, it was the formal shots they wanted the most! some people think they want all candids, but every couple wants those tradional Portraits of thier wedding they can pass on. ** all opinions are different, this is proven success for me.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Brenda- are you talking about the wedding that you opened this thread on, or another one? I think Jerry is very right on not worrying TOO much about a pose list, but I think it's good to study one ahead just to have some "dont miss it" shots swirling around in the brain :) The day is so crazy, and each one will be so different. I put in my contract that it was UP TO ME what the actual shots would be, although I'd do my best to fulfill any specific requests they have.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
it's a great check list - and have fun!!! Look for the pix that are happening outside your viewfinder (the flower girl stealing the show in one of mine, the grooms face as the bride comes down the aisle, the mom/dads face/tears...!) As I said Brenda, its a check-list, of course you're never going to get everything - but it was a good guideline for someone who has never done a wedding. I don't particularly like anything too posed, but you're not going to have too many granny's sitting on logs of wood, or perched on a fence, nor will you get the really fat bride doing either. Shoot from the heart, and capture the moment and the spirit.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
"I belive you need to know what your couple is looking for and protect yourself. I had 2 weddings that were sure they DID NOT want any posed shots, HA! when all was done and we sat down to look, it was the formal shots they wanted the most!" Debbie, I have had this happen too. Which is why I started doing shot lists again. I stopped them for all of 2005. And, of course, had an issue with a client. What I did was bring them in, re-show my sample albums that they saw when they booked. I discussed while it was impossible to take the same shots, the style and type of photography I represented is what they got. In the end, they agreed. And, we left it on good terms. The thing is, you can only do what you can do, You have to be careful about what you represent. My style evolves, and things change somtimes. If I have a client that booked me 1.5 years ago, I call them in for a planning session and show them some new stuff and get their reaction. So far, it's always been good. I like to think that I keep up with what's going on, and with what I think brides want to see, and I also like to keep refreshing myself. I explain this to people at our initial consult too...that is, that things change, I change, I show them an album from when I used to shoot very tight, and then show them today, where I shoot very wide. Some brides don't get it, some love it. Of course, guys always say, "I didn't know there was so much to it, I thought you just take a few pictures". Anyway, my shot list is very short and to the point and allows for about 15 minutes of formals. If they want more shots, they have to allow for the time, and tell me specifically what they want. By the way, during the formals, ALWYAS keep your camera up and look all around you all the time. I probably take way more candids during the formals than I do of the formals. My eyes are always scanning the situation. And, here's a tip for anyone new. When you are done taking a formal shot, lower your camera a tad, and tell them they are done, then as soon as they relax, which takes about 1/2 second, start shooting. You will get your best shots at that moment. jerry
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Thanks for the input Jerry. I like your idea of waiting for them to relax and getting some more great shots. I should know tomorrow if I'll have the job or not. As for the list, I'm trying to use everything I seen or heard to come up with a small simple list too. I don't want to be held accountable for something I can't get or may miss. Since this would be my first wedding, I partly wanted it to help me remember what to shoot. My first wedding was 20 years ago... I don't remember what they took. And my second (and last) wedding was a great easy, relaxed event at Niagra Falls and the photographer got some great shots for us. So I just want to be sure that in the back of my mind I'm remembering the "big" shots. I have no problem with the candids, because I'm always looking for the "story" in everything I see around me. I like your idea of keeping the formals to 15 minutes too. If I get this wedding it won't take long because it's not big. Okay, gotta run... my one tv vice is on soon... Project Runway finale. Can't miss it. I'll post tomorrow after I know if I got it.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Carrie H |
Hi Brenda, and Denyse ~ I just uploaded a few pictures in my gallery. Let me know what you think please. Have a great night everyone! I Hope you got the job Brenda, and thanks for your help today. Carrie
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Carrie, I just peeked quick b/c I'm at my office job :) I like the 'celebration of love', a great candid catch w/ lots of emotion. And the mother & daughter one is precious, I like the softness and expressions. I would have liked to see it without the house/siding on the right. All trees in the background would've been perfect.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Brenda/Denyse and all, I'm u/loading pix to my gallery from Saturdays wedding - I'd love some comments :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
Robyn, what did you want us to look at. first, the images look too crowded. try to step back and include other elements, or just more space. i'm not a fan of people looking at the camera. it blows the whole thing and has no emotion, usually. I know, there are exceptions, but they are rare. for the small sample here, you didn't catch any moments, tears of joy, clapping, dancing, laughter, or any special moments tha tells the story of how it FELT to be there. you documented what it looked like, but not how it FELT. overall a great job, and the couple will be happy. don't take my criticism the wrong way. but, hopefully it will help you next time.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Wow Jerry, I just went back and looked at my gallery, not sure we looked at the same one! I reckon I got some pretty special moments there, as well as some pretty casual ones - I could hardly expect the grannies to sit on the ground. As for tightly cropped.... I checked your gallery and noted your ring pic. Dad handing over his daughter doesn't show emotion? Kids crawling under the alter? A bride running across the grass? Lassoing her groom with her scarf - I don't mind criticism Jerry, but .... maybe you got the wrong gallery.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Carrie H |
Hi Robyn ~ I looked at your gallery, and I really liked it! How long have you been taking pictures? Do you do it fulltime? Carmen was a beautiful bride! I loved the picture of you (?)putting her necklace on. I really liked the one of them walking away holding hands and then turning to look back. I am sure they will be really happy with all of the great shots! Thanks Denyse for looking at my gallery. I agree totally with your comment re: the siding to the right, but it wasn't a posed shot(I was taking a picture of someone else and happened to catch her giving her daughter a hug.) I didn't want to interrupt for fear that it wouldn't look the same if I had posed it, so I took it.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Thanks Carrie, it was my first wedding (shadowing the official photographer). Carmens Mom was my sister who passed away 4 years ago on the 3/3, Carmen got married on the 4th. Linda was 48. It was a very emotional day, but a wonderful one, especially as she wanted me with her from the start, we did our hair and everything together. I was honoured and tasked with putting on her necklace and veil, and thank heavens for autofocus, coz many of the pix I was really battling to see through the tears! My monitor is not calibrated, and I'm battling my way through PS, so also wanted to know if the colours looked ok. My lab will also adjust I'm sure. Thanks again :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
i usually don't critique, and I NEVER WILL AGAIN! I was trying to be helpful. you know, if you truly don't want criticism, then don't ask for it. just ridiculous. I guess you just want people to suck your @$$ and tell you how beautiful everything is. sorry. I was trying to be helpful and give you some tips. if you don't like my work, that's fine, but I DIDN'T ASK YOU TO CRITIQUE MY WORK! jerry
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Actually Jerry you do crit a lot of peoples work, and have a lot to say, and if you're going to have a gallery you open yourself up to people looking at your work, thereby inviting them to crit, otherwise you wouldn't be on this site, although sometimes I wonder why?I don't have a problem with criticism if its constructive, yours isn't - now take you PMT pill and maybe when you wake in the morning you'll feel better. Your attitude on this thread and others is very aggressive - "Robyn what did you want us to look at?" well my pix you dolt.... what the hell did you think? Sorry, but you really have attitude, and no, I'm not looking for anyone to suck anything of mine, just be constructive.... especially when there are pix in your gallery along the lines of which you're critting in mine. Goodnight all, and thanks.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
i'm outta here. but, when I asked what do we look at, usually there is a specific area to look at. just saying look at these pics isn't helpful to the person critquing. after you gain more experience, you'll understand this. but, its a little like asking about how the world began. where the hell do you start. and what do they mean by the world, the creation, the heavens and earth, the history of man, the english history or the far east history, the bible, or something else. I mean it is very, very vague. so, when someone just says critique this, I put on a hat as a jufge would in a contest. weell, that's usually not what someone like you means, and I know that. so, I was being constructive. if you can't take criticism, then dont ask. there's no other way to put it. i'm not aggressive, just direct. that offend some people. but it doesn't matter to me. i'm not really here playing nice, I just enjoy the topic of photography. I like discussing it and talking about it. i NEVER critique peoples work. I say things about what people say, or I say things when they say, 'i have a wedding tomorrow, this is my first one, what type of equipment do I need?' yes, that kind of irks me because I take this profession very seriously. and that smacks of total disrespect for the art of wedding photography. anyway, you are not understanding what I mean by allowing more space. it doesn't mean never shoot tight, there were just some shots that looked squeezed to me. they needed some air to lighten them up and take out the stress. there are no pics along the lines of yours. at first glance, maybe it appears that way, but it's different. look, you asked me to look, I did, and then you attacked. I didn't attack you at all, I gave you an honest critque. I tried to give you something to look at and think about, that's all. adn then you immediately launch into an attack of my words. this is why when I hire people to work for me, I have a sit down and explain that there is nothing personal about. so if you get huffy when I tell you things, then you might want to find another line of work. i have enjoyed this website, but I think it's time to say goodbye. this is just something i'm not used to at an on-line discussion. everywhere else I talk is good a professional and critques are honest, and you listen and learn. i've never seen someone get all crappy like this on a critique in my life. you think I have the bad attitude, you need to turn the mirror on yourself dear.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
i'm outta here. but, when I asked what do we look at, usually there is a specific area to look at. just saying look at these pics isn't helpful to the person critquing. after you gain more experience, you'll understand this. but, its a little like asking about how the world began. where the hell do you start. and what do they mean by the world, the creation, the heavens and earth, the history of man, the english history or the far east history, the bible, or something else. I mean it is very, very vague. so, when someone just says critique this, I put on a hat as a jufge would in a contest. weell, that's usually not what someone like you means, and I know that. so, I was being constructive. if you can't take criticism, then dont ask. there's no other way to put it. i'm not aggressive, just direct. that offend some people. but it doesn't matter to me. i'm not really here playing nice, I just enjoy the topic of photography. I like discussing it and talking about it. i NEVER critique peoples work. I say things about what people say, or I say things when they say, 'i have a wedding tomorrow, this is my first one, what type of equipment do I need?' yes, that kind of irks me because I take this profession very seriously. and that smacks of total disrespect for the art of wedding photography. anyway, you are not understanding what I mean by allowing more space. it doesn't mean never shoot tight, there were just some shots that looked squeezed to me. they needed some air to lighten them up and take out the stress. there are no pics along the lines of yours. at first glance, maybe it appears that way, but it's different. look, you asked me to look, I did, and then you attacked. I didn't attack you at all, I gave you an honest critque. I tried to give you something to look at and think about, that's all. adn then you immediately launch into an attack of my words. this is why when I hire people to work for me, I have a sit down and explain that there is nothing personal about. so if you get huffy when I tell you things, then you might want to find another line of work. i have enjoyed this website, but I think it's time to say goodbye. this is just something i'm not used to at an on-line discussion. everywhere else I talk is good a professional and critques are honest, and you listen and learn. i've never seen someone get all crappy like this on a critique in my life. you think I have the bad attitude, you need to turn the mirror on yourself dear.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
x |
i'm outta here. but, when I asked what do we look at, usually there is a specific area to look at. just saying look at these pics isn't helpful to the person critquing. after you gain more experience, you'll understand this. but, its a little like asking about how the world began. where the hell do you start. and what do they mean by the world, the creation, the heavens and earth, the history of man, the english history or the far east history, the bible, or something else. I mean it is very, very vague. so, when someone just says critique this, I put on a hat as a jufge would in a contest. weell, that's usually not what someone like you means, and I know that. so, I was being constructive. if you can't take criticism, then dont ask. there's no other way to put it. i'm not aggressive, just direct. that offend some people. but it doesn't matter to me. i'm not really here playing nice, I just enjoy the topic of photography. I like discussing it and talking about it. i NEVER critique peoples work. I say things about what people say, or I say things when they say, 'i have a wedding tomorrow, this is my first one, what type of equipment do I need?' yes, that kind of irks me because I take this profession very seriously. and that smacks of total disrespect for the art of wedding photography. anyway, you are not understanding what I mean by allowing more space. it doesn't mean never shoot tight, there were just some shots that looked squeezed to me. they needed some air to lighten them up and take out the stress. there are no pics along the lines of yours. at first glance, maybe it appears that way, but it's different. look, you asked me to look, I did, and then you attacked. I didn't attack you at all, I gave you an honest critque. I tried to give you something to look at and think about, that's all. adn then you immediately launch into an attack of my words. this is why when I hire people to work for me, I have a sit down and explain that there is nothing personal about. so if you get huffy when I tell you things, then you might want to find another line of work. i have enjoyed this website, but I think it's time to say goodbye. this is just something i'm not used to at an on-line discussion. everywhere else I talk is good a professional and critques are honest, and you listen and learn. i've never seen someone get all crappy like this on a critique in my life. you think I have the bad attitude, you need to turn the mirror on yourself dear.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Risa M. Desmarais |
Wow, this string got weird pretty quickly. I, too, was looking for some advice, tips, shared experiences. Doing my 3rd wedding in June 2006. Things learned on the first 2 - which were literally night and day from each other. The first was spending the day with the bride & groom down on Cape Cod and their ceremony was on the beach. I will try to put some shots up on a gallery as soon as I figure that out, but the lesson learned was that as the photographer, you need to know what will work and won't work with your exposures. They wanted the sunset behind them - yikes! I should have known better, but on the whole, they weren't awfull, just some under exposed. The better shots were all with the sun behind me - thank god I took a bagillion shots - I also set up my digital camera on a tripod to get a "movie" of the ceremony - lesson learned: the beach is windy and JPs often don't speak loud enough. Would have been better if there was someone with a windsheild upstream of the gusts. The candids were best, and a shot of the gown hanging from a door with natural light was a nice one, too. Very casual second wedding for both - a day at the beach with their kids was also a bonus of fun candids. The second wedding was at a house, at night, with tons of people - lots of formnal groups, etc. The client was also a friend like the first wedding- it was her Mom's wedding and the ceremony was in Spanish. It was truly lovely, but the house got hot pretty quickly with all the people. Lesson learned on this one was: don't get too creative without practicing- if you get a couple of filters, try them out first -I accidentally left my soft focus filter on, the next thing I know, they want the large group shots - all the men, all the women, etc. They were all soft focused and appeared rather blurry with all the people. I kicked myself when I got home to realize that the soft focus filter was still on my camera - egads - I apologized to her, but couldn't do much by way of photoshop to help the images. Henceforth, I worry more about light and exposure with my upcoming gig in June. The setting is going to be gorgeous - a victorian home in Massachusetts with stunning grounds, etc. I'm planning a day to visit early in April - they have house tours, etc. I'll bring my son and a friend and test various lighting scenarios. Wanting to also get a speedlight flash for my Canon Rebel 35mm SLR, to better ensure proper fill flash, etc. Get it soon and get used to it. Don't know if my leassons learned will be useful, but I just want to thank you all for posting things that have helped me out on pricing, products, etc. The 2 I've done were basic portfolio experiences for me - I charged cost & a bit extra to cover travel expenses. I put the 4x6 proofs in an album and identify what roll and neg number the shot is in those album margins. I get the 35mm onto a disk for them that I put in an envelope in the back of the album. Helps them find the negs. The negs are theirs, and I save the digital images on CDs at home. Risa
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Welcome Risa! Robyn- Many of your images are quite lovely... I think Bowling her over and Baby blues were my favorite. Lots of emotion there for me, and I'm partial to the softness and b&w/sepia. As for the rest of the conversation... It's a continual problem between the high-end pros and us newbies. We don't see eye to eye on most anything. Period. :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Thanks Denyse - I'm waiting for the prints - is one ever satisfied with the 'final' edit? I always think theres something else that could be done. I've just seen a portrait that Kawla Kelly did in BW and its to die for! My BW's NEVER have that clarity!! I'm going to try tips she gave out :) Welcome Risa, you'll learn plenty at BP, I'm looking forward to seeing your gallery.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
ROBERTO AMEZCUA |
Risa, I applaud your courange... and thank you for sharing your experiences. Those really made me go through my plan one more time. I too am joining the "My first wedding" club, I'm doing this for a close friend who asked me to. I've definately be learning from everyone including Jerry. Thanks!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
:) Well I survived my first! It was a rushed inexpensive wedding, thus hiring me, a friend to do the photography. The church was this quant little 100 year old white church. Beautiful on the outside....Nightmare for lighting inside! I didn't get to see it till 2 weeks before the wedding. I told the bride then that I didn't have the equipment to really get good pictures with this low of light. I suggested that we take most of the group shots outside on the cute steps. It rained for the first time in 180 days. Great for the community, but heck on my nerves! I got some cute shots under umbrellas. The bride is fine with the picutes taken, she said that I warned her. My lesson learn: You can never get enough posed shots of just the bride and groom! The ones in the church have shadows and are dark. PSing them hasn't helped much. I never got a real good printable shot of the bride and groom for the paper. :( They can however aquire the tux top again and we will get some when the weather clears up. They are such good sports! I so appreciate them for having faith in me! I only have one posted on my gallery so far. I work full time and I'm trying to get through them. Thank you for all the tips!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Shelly, glad you survived :) I feel for you on the bad light inside. I was lucky- my first had great flourescent lights, and the one this summer is a rec hall, so again there will be plenty of light. Glad you followed up w/ your experience & I'm looking forward to seeing more when you get them posted. Leave a note on this thread when you do so we can check back.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
Thank you for the responce Denyse! I finally have gotten a few of the artistic shots uploaded for viewing. I've really enjoyed looking through everyone's galleries. On a positive note, they already have a friend that wants a price sheet and my FIL has a co-worker wanting to talk to me.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Shelly- you're off to a good start! Great rings shot. I like the highlight one too, cool effect... can you turn the saturation down a little & see how it looks? It'll reduce the orange tint a bit. I'm going to check out the rest of your gallery. I love the farm scenery, so different from where I am! Word of mouth is the best advertiser!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Shelley these are so far so good! I also like the ring and window shot, but agree that the one of the bride on her own has blown the top of her veil a little - fiddle a little with that, coz otherwise its a lovely pic :) Lets see more - I'm doing my 2nd wedding on Sunday - not shadowing the professional, just me (!) so am a little nervous. I've just returned my F2.8 lens, as it was very soft, and am getting the new one tonight, so will have to do some serious practising on the family!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
Thank you Denyse and Robyn. I so appreciate the critique on the highlight shot. I wasn't totally pleased with it myself, but everyone has told me it was wonderful, so I wasn't sure what else to mess with. Denyse, thank you for looking at the rest of my gallery. I just love taking pictures of my kids and horses. Thats how I got started. :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Shelly- you make a point I'm often trying to express... the average person doesn't know anything about photography, and while we might think a shot needs work, they may think it's the best thing ever! So we CAN please our lower budget clients, even if we're still learning and our work isn't Pro (yet!). Robyn- yeah!! Can't wait to see your pics!!! Let us know when you post some!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Will do Brenda, I've just taken a few test shots with the new lens and its SHARP!!! :) So will have something to post on Monday I hope - hold thumbs!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
Good luck with that new lens Robyn, I'm looking forward to seeing what you post!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Shelly L. Rauscher |
Those have a great DOF! Very clear! *thumbs up* :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Robyn- I thought the original 800 image was great... until I saw the PS one, then I was torn! lol. I think they're both great, and if a client only saw one version or the other, they wouldn't know what they were missing & would be happy either way I think!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Hi All, I had to check through 9 pages to find the thread!! I finally uploaded some pix from the 2nd wedding, and a 21st I did in a Fashion Cafe on Saturday evening. I'd love some comments, and will put more on the site as and when.... but I'm leaving tomorrow at 0600 for the Kruger National Park (Google it guys!) Its a group of 8 ladies, no kids, no husbands, no MOBILES, no TRAFFIC!!! Just us and our camera's, a tracker and game ranger (think Camel ad's), and we're doing a walking safari. So... pls check out the wedding pix and post me some comments (I'll probably only reply after the 11th), thats if the lions and hippo's don't get me :) BTW, the processing of all these pix simply takes AGES!!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Hi Robyn! I'm jealous of your trip!!! I need to get away so bad! Hope you are having a fabulous time... Ok, my absolute favorites: Along with the ones you emailed me... there is no way the B&G won't be thrilled!! I'll be excited to see pics from the Park when you get back! I'm going to google it now :) HEY BRENDA, if you're still following this thread- what was the verdict for your wedding job? You know, the one that started this thread, lol.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
Hey Denyse, I'm lurking lately. I've been trying to get my family over all these colds & being sick. I didn't get that wedding on the 15th. I gave her my prices and she said they were too high for what they wanted to spend. I said okay and let it go. I did just hear of someone today who is looking for a photographer for an October wedding so I may drop them an note. I'm not losing any sleep over not getting that job, I wasn't 100% sure I wanted to do weddings and I'm still not. I've been trying to do some deep searching and try to figure out what direction I really want my photography to go and I'm not decided yet. I'm glad you all are getting those wedding jobs and doing so well with them. Robyn, I've got your gallery open now and I'm trying to check them all out. What I've seen so far looks really great. Gotta run... I'll try to get around more often now that everyone is starting to mend here. :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Hey Brenda! I hear ya, I'm in the "I dont know how I feel about shooting weddings" boat too. I have one in july that is low key, but I turned one down for august that seemed out of my league. I have some other fun events lined up this summer- a car club banquet & car show, and a railway historical society family event. I'm looking forward to those because it's all candids, just shots for the clubs to use on their website, no pressure!! I'm content to take it all very very slowly. From the looks of the website, Robyn is having the TIME OF HER LIFE and will have some amazing photos when she gets back!!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Hi girls :) Finally finished editing the last wedding - now I need a physio for my shoulders, and an Optition... I've just uploaded some more tonight, please let me have your comments. Please bear in mind it was 12 o clock midday, awful bright sun, and even after the reception we went to the dam at about 1630 and it was still too hot and the sun way too harsh, so.... did what I could! I'll start editing the Kruger National Park pix tomorrow - it was awesome. We were about 30m from a humungous rhino bull, female and calf, and they caught wind of us - you want to see 8 ladies aged between 40-50 run like hell and hide!! Lying in you tent in the middle of the bush listening to leopards growl, hyena's howl and various other things that go bump in the night was WOW!!! We were walking in the bush and heard (and felt) the lions roar in the early morning - but they were probably about 1-2km away, and we'd never find them, so we were content with the magnificent sound!! Watch this space :)
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Been going through the bush pix, and I'm disappointed :( Used my 28-300 lens most of the time, but over the distance there was just too much camera shake! The Landrover, people moving in the vehicle, even breathing has an effect!! I've uploaded some to the gallery, will also add some here. I was obviously a bit shaky when the rhino was around - didn't get any good pix of that ;( I guess you'll all just have to come over here and see for yourself. In fact a walking safari is bliss - you book out the camp for 8 people (4 couples) and walk for 3 days - sublime!! Ok battling to upload here - I think they're in the gallery! Apologies
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Brenda M. Wolfensberger |
www.photosbybrenda.com/heath Sorry, I don't know how to make it a link. :( See ya!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Now they're a clever couple - if you're gonna elope and take friends, make sure at least one of them is a damn good photographer! You've captured this beautifully - they look so lovely and casual and the set table offsets it so well. I love the setting sun on them, and the lighting on the table. Really great - well done - I hope you u/load more to your gallery for us to look at!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Jodie Potter |
Brenda, great job with the wedding picks, there are some real sweet shots of the couple, very natural. I bet after seeing your photos they were glad that you were there for them. The photos with the writting in the sand was a nice touch.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Hi Brenda (and Robyn!) Yeah!! They were so lucky to have you along. What great captures for them!!! I love some of your ideas... I have my 2nd wedding coming up this saturday, and it is also on a beach. (well, AT a beach) It's a very public/busy area, so that will limit me somewhat, but I am going to look at your shots again for more inspiration. And thanks for the follow up, I LOVE seeing the results!!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
It was a very casual wedding, and I really think the client will be happy. Here are a few of my favorites from the day...
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Sounds like they could have been related :) Pix so far look great - maybe because of his magnetic personality he couldn't FIND any guys to partner the bridesmaids!!! I've another wedding coming up 02 September - hope it'll be warmer here then!! The couple are really nice, so I'm hoping for some great shots!! Talking of pix - take a look at one of our local magazines - www.pixmag.co.za - I think we're up there with the 'international' stuff - what do you think? BTW, had a meeting yesterday with management from a hospital thats being built, and they want me to do all the artwork (pix!!!!) for the walls - different areas will have different themes etc - but I'm soooooo excited!! I know I shouldn't count my chickens..... bu maybe I can then buy a 2nd camera body!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Emily Geddes |
I really hope I am not barging in... my sister was recently married. A good resource might be a wedding website called www.theknot.com Under search type photography and a million articles come up. Obviously this is a bride focused site but they have ideas for storybooks, not to miss photo ops and "expert advice on unique wedding-day shots". Hope this helps.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Robyn Gwilt |
Hey Emily, thats what we all do, barge in.... thats how we learn! :) Had a quick squiz at the site and there's stax to read up on - very interesting thanks. Will read more tonight - off to work. Its the coldest day we've had in Johannesburg this winter ....9deg! I know its nothing for some of you, but for us, well is damn cold, we have to wear a jacket and scarf!!!
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Denyse Clark |
Robyn, Really cool about the hospital, that's a great honor. A 2nd camera body, *sigh*, I hear you, I'd love to get one too. I have a film body for my back up, which is fine, but I think I'm so done carrying all those canisters around "just in case". Ironic that you are having one of your coldest days... we are hitting close to 100 deg F again today! It's a record for us in Western NY. Hi Emily, I'm going to check out the website too, thanks for the info.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
Jerry Frazier |
Take what you read on The Knot with a grain of salt. There is lots of very poor information there about wedding photography. Most photographers who make a living at wedding photography kind of laugh at the info the Knot presents. There's some good stuff, but there's some really horrid and just plain bad information there. So, while it's great to read it, please don't follow it. That's just a little advice from someone who is extremely and intimately familiar with The Knot and their brides. It can be a great resource. The best part of it is to go into the chat rooms and see what brides are saying. But, also, be careful. Only certain brides have time to chat on-line. So, they DO NOT represent all of the Knot. While that might seem obvious, it also might not be. Anyway, just have fun.
|
|||||||
|
|
||||||||
|
This old forum is now archived. Use improved Forum here
Report this Thread |
||||||||