 David L. Pabst |
Best Way to Back Up Photo Files? With all the new bells and whistles out there has this old farm boy wondering what is the best way for me to go to backup photo files - CD, DVD, external hard drive?
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W. |
Hi David, what do you mean by "the best way for me to go to backup photo files"? The easiest way? Or the safest way?
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David L. Pabst |
Hi W.S. The safest way to store them for generations
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Brock E. Litton |
i say the more the merrier. I back mine up every so often to dvd , I have them on my computer hard drive of course , and I have an external hard drive that I back up every time I load new pics. I have the dvd's in my car and my external at my parents house so that way if my car and house get blown up by a terrorist I still have my external somewhere else. Brock
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W. |
Imo, the safest way is to burn them to DVD-R's. Two copies, each to be stored at a physically different place. Since the chemicals in the plastics in DVD's also react with each other (and with light? And with gases in the air?), which slowly deteriorates (destroys) them to the point of being unreadable/illegible, it is very advisable to burn new copies of your DVD-R's - on new DVD-R's, of course - every 2 years (then destroy the 'old' ones). However, this won't be "for generations", if only for the fact that PC's, system software and 'reading' software will be so different from today's in, say 20 years, that your DVD-R's - however pristine and perfect - most probably can't be read by then. Storing on hard disks is easy. But extremely volatile. (Hard disks fail!).
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David L. Pabst |
Just want to say think you for the advice and I will just keep backing up with extra DVD’s Thanks a bunch for you help David
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Garth Wunsch |
I am only one year into serious digital shooting (after nearly fifty years of film work). I too faced this dilemma of ensuring the future safety of my digital negatives. A much more digitally experienced photographer suggested I purchase Peter Krogh's book, "The DAM Book / Digital Asset Management for Photographers". Krogh covers, in great detail, a very comprehensive methodology for managing our digital files. He also covers other issues that are critical to digital photography such as filing systems that actually allow you to find one image in 1,000,000 (he has over one terabyte of images). He also covers the issue of file formats and converting your files to the Adobe supported DNG format. Many photographers are not aware that the file extensions on their photographs are proprietary to the company (e.g. NEF for Nikon) and that these formats may change over time and may in fact no longer be readable at some future date, even if the storage media is. This is why Adobe has committed to supporting the DNG format "forever" and as industry leader is encouraging others to follow suit. The very high end cameras now allow for selection of DNG right in the camera. If you convert your files to the DNG format and create appropriate backups, you have done everything possible (with today's technology) to ensure the longevity of your images. I have found Krogh's material to be heavy going, but worth the effort. Part of the problem rests with me, because of my extremely steep learning curve... I went digital, purchased Photoshop CS2 and switched from PC to Mac, all within a few months of each other. I haven't regretted any one of the moves, but they have all kept the gray matter in high gear. Regards Garth Wunsch
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Heather M. Wareham |
oh I have been down loading all my pictures to CD-R I have about seven know. Is this ok or should it have been DVD-R and if so why. I found when I downloaded them to DVD it didn't let me add any more at least with the CD-R as I take the pictures I add them to the Disc. Look forward the the comments.
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W. |
DVD's hold 6 times as many photos as CD's do, Heather. Storing on DVD is therefore cheaper, easier, and quicker.
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Heather M. Wareham |
are you DVD RW DVD becuase when I tried to add picture just to my DVD-R it only lets you add them once then when you go to put more on the disc it saids it full. Thats why I changed to CD-R. Every time I take new pictures I like to save them to disc becuase I have had to format my computer and lost pictures.
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W. |
If your blank DVD's won't accept more than one photo, there is obviously something wrong. Was it just that one DVD (it could be an incidental 'dud'), or does the same thing happen with all blank DVD's you try to burn? If the latter is the case, it may be something YOU do (or don't): your "M.O." (Modus Operandi), which should be different.
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Jeff Beard-Shouse |
David, Being a software engineer, a computer tech for years, and now a aspiring photographer, I now exactly how you feel, I have been fighting the battle to keep my data for years as well. It has been suggested that dvds are good for storing data, which can be true, but as was pointed out they last 2-5 years. Other people have dismissed the hard drive because it is volatile, which it true (altough I would say dvds are more volatile, they scratch easy). One thing I want to point out is with hard drives you can RAID(Random Array of Independent /Inexpensive Disks) them together. There are several different kinds of RAIDs but use the one that clones data from one hard drive to the next when it is written. When one hard drive fails (average lifetime for a hard drive is probably more that dvds, I think) you can just replace that one hard drive in your raid and the data will automatically get rebuilt on it. For some Raid systems you may need some technical experience to set up, but I think there are probably some ways that dont, maybe setting up a NAS(Network attached storage). Plus with a NAS you can access you data from anywhere on your network or internet if you set it up that way. IMHO the RAID is a much better system than dvds. You have access to it all the time (unlike dvds on the self), it will rebuild a failed hard drive automatically, and you can upgrade your storage easily (just put bigger hard drives or more hard drives in when you have money). A co-worker of mine just built himself a terabyte Raid array. For more info check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redundant_array_of_independent_disks or email me clarke.hackworth(at)gmail.com
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W. |
While all true, Jeff, imo you're barking up the wrong tree here. Because the RAID concept and proper execution is 1) too complicated for 90% of users, 2) not applicable to 97% of users - because they don't have external harddrives, and 3) for long-term storage it is not advisable to consider "average" lifetime. MINIMUM lifetime is the appropriate benchmark for long-term storage.
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Jeff Beard-Shouse |
W. Smith, you are correct that alot of RAID systems are too complicated for the average user, but check this out http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.php?EdpNo=2719711&CatId=2670 it is an external RAID case, just buy it and two hard drives, install hard drives (pretty easy just use screw driver and follow instructions), set the switch on the back, plug it into to computer and off you go. the ones with four HDs are more money but if your not a tech person your used to paying the microsoft and bestbuy prices, so its not that bad. As for the minimum lifetime I understand what you are saying (and you are right), but if you have a raid because its backed up on two or more hard drives you can look at the average time to failer with a fair amount of certainty because of the redundency (ie when one HD fails just replace it then). plus you can alway buy an exta HD, back stuff up and set it on the self not being used. HDs not in use will last alot longer than dvds not in use. really it is just a matter of what a person is willing to invest and how important that data is to them. dvds are fine and all but the people who know about how to store data use raids look at yahoo, google, even microsoft they all use raids to back up data (they use tape backups as well). Anyway, if anyone is interested I would encourage people to do some research on the topic and or talk to your local tech friend. Again just my 2 cents.
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Garth Wunsch |
Heather, I'm not a DVD burner expert, but I am learning... You need to be using DVD RW and when you burn you have to configure your particular burner to allow you to have continuous or multiple sessions so you can come back later and add more images to the disc. Regarding what is most appropriate, DVD's or external drives, Krogh (see my post above) suggests and uses both. Regards
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Bill Chachkes |
I'm using a Three Tiered Back up plan for my Photos and Video. 1) a 400Gb 7200 Rpm back up HD 2) DVD-RW stored onsite 3) second set of DVD-RW's in my saftey dep. box The reason being: In 1988 I lost my Uncle in a house fire. Even though He was a retired Police Detective(homicide and crime scene before that) he never had a storage system for his own personal data, and his photos were stuffed haphazardly in Large folders strewn about his work area and on shelving in his work area. Result, not only did we lose him, we lost 90% of his life's work in Painting and Photography. This taught me the lesson of having multiple back ups. I started in the mid-90's with Zip Disks(boxes Full) and began burning CD's and then DVD's a few years ago. I back up and rotate each set every 14 days. It may be a pain, but I have every shot I have taken since 1995, from every single camera I have ever owned(both Traditional and Digital) and this fills up most of a 100 Gb Partition on the back up drive, and about 11 DVD's(RW) Bill C
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Stephen J. Dyer |
David I have ran a sign business for the last 15 years, we started backing up to 5.25" discs, then 3.5" discs, After about 3 years the discs were getting to be a bit of a pain to back up to so we started backing up to hard drives. We had everything on a PC hard drive that acted as a centeral darta server, this was backed up to another hard drive on a different PC each night and a removable hard drive each week which is taken off site. Now 12 years later all our data is available, instantly. Over this time we have had about 12 hard discs fail and have only lost a couple of files. I had a RAID system once and one of the hard discs faild in an unusal way that the raid did not detect, this corruped both drives in the raid system, so I tossed out the RAID system. For my photos I have 2 500GB external SATA drives one is my main drive the other is a back up which is updated regually, I also have a third USB2 drive which is keep offsite and backed up every week or so. I also burn CD's /DVD's just to be sure. Steve
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Heather M. Wareham |
Ya I thought it was DVD-RW I know you can write and rewrite on that. I have nero and I tried to put Pictures more then one on DVD it kept saying it was full after down loading them But on the CD-R I can keep adding and adding till it full. I should get CD-RW so I can change the picture as fixs them up. I guess my sister has got something he added to her computer to down load picture and music and things you don't want to lose if you have to reformat your computer. I just want to keep it simple add to disk is sumple enough for me and I don't have to meny pictures yet that its taken up to much space. I have 29 photo album that I scanned and put on disc and meny more picture I have taken since them they are all on 7 disc so I guess CD discs hold lost of pictures too. I will go and try the DVD-RW one more time to see if it works.
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Marvin Swetzer |
Everything that I have read says not to use DVD's for long-term storage. CD's will last much longer. You can still buy record players, but I haven't seen 8-Tracks for a long time.
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Daniel O |
David, May I add my 2cents? I am not a professional techno guy, but it seems to me that the storage system that you are comfortable with and will *use* is the best one. My 3-part plan: The possibilities are infinite, but your system should be simple, IMHO. Dan
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David L. Pabst |
Thanks everyone Once more I would like to say thanks to every one that has help me out and I appreciate the time that you took to answer my question this is helpful know what other people are doing. This is the first time that I have used the Q & A and with all of the help I will be back with more questions in the future. David
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Marc Apfelstadt |
David: It looks like you've gotten a lot of information. Let me add just a couple of points. Most of the messages above reference the -R specification for disc media & recording. There is research showing that +R(RW) format is more secure, robust, and less error prone than -R(RW) format. Search www.CDFreaks.com for articles by Michael Spath to see the technical details (probably way deeper than you want to know about). To the problem of "adding more pictures"... DVD+R and DVD-R are write once, read many... so you can't add data after burning the disc. One record pass, you're done. DVD+RW and DVD-RW are "write many, read many"... a much more feasible way to add files if that's a goal. Using CD-R (or CD+R)and adding files, you must be "leaving the session open" rather than closing/completing the session (which makes further writing impossible). While that works reasonably well, I have sometimes had problems opening "unclosed CD-R media" on other drives/machines, and/or with different disc writing software. Use caution in leaving discs open, if "safe backup" is your goal. Once it's complete/full, then close the session to be safe. Cheers,
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W. |
OK, guys, here's something to tickle your fancy. How does this sound: "very cheap but have the advantage of very long term storage (100+ years)"? Here's where you get the story:
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