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Jointly Traveling..

BetterPhoto.com Photo Contest SECOND PLACE Winner
BetterPhoto.com Photo of the Day  
Jointly Traveling..
Jointly Traveling..
Comments are wellcome...
© Manjee JOya
Canon EOS 20D Digi...
 
 
 
Anthony M. Muscatello     Absolutely amazing. I love the silhouettes. Great work.


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2/7/2007 5:28:25 PM

 
Michael S. Baker
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/14/2004
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Agree with Anthony. The Silhouettes are excellent! Well composed too!
Regards,
Mike B-


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2/17/2007 10:42:30 PM

 
Remi Trepanier
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/1/2006
 

Amazing!!! A winner for me!!!


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2/20/2007 6:49:07 AM

 
Kay E. Mahoney
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/23/2003
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Congratulations on your beautiful finalist. Good luck in the next round.


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3/22/2007 9:29:19 PM

 
anonymous 
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/17/2005
 

Awesome image Ali...congratulations on your finalist.


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3/23/2007 3:54:35 PM

 
Kay E. Mahoney
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/23/2003
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Congratulations on your second place winner.


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3/24/2007 7:44:36 PM

 
randy dannheim
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/21/2006
 

Ali, this is just gorgouse. Congratulation on your 2nd place winner


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3/24/2007 8:01:46 PM

 
Janine Russell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/22/2005
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Ali, excellent tones, detail, clarity, silhouettes and lighting; congratulations on your Second Place Win.


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3/24/2007 8:17:05 PM

 
Kathleen K. Parker
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/30/2000
kathleenkparkerphotography.com
 

Absolutely wonderful, Ali!! Congratulations on your fine win!
kk


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3/25/2007 4:48:16 AM

 
anonymous 
BetterPhoto Member Since: 10/17/2005
 

Congratulations on you second place win Ali! WTG


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3/25/2007 4:49:43 AM

 
Michael S. Baker
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/14/2004
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Congratulations, Ali...a well deserved win!
Regards,
Mike B-


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3/25/2007 7:10:11 AM

 
Amalia Elena Veralli
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/28/2005
amaliaphotography.com
 

Great winning image!! Congratulations!!


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3/25/2007 1:12:10 PM

 
Jim Monty  

How did you do this picture? I love the photo - it has great drama, but did you do some digital manipulation after shooting?


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3/25/2007 7:17:54 PM

 
Patrick R. McMullen
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/1/2004
 

Great editing on it! It's simple and effective. Congratulations on it.
Pat


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3/27/2007 5:21:45 AM

 
Lisa J. Boulden
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/2/2006
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Superb image! --Lisa


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3/29/2007 4:30:00 AM

 
Fawn  M. Schutt
BetterPhoto Member Since: 8/31/2004
 

That is so beautiful. Nice work!


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3/29/2007 2:14:30 PM

 
Melissa Wynn
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/23/2006
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A beautiful image. All the elements work well together. Love the silhouettes. Nicely done!


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4/9/2007 11:17:28 PM

 
Kate Jackson
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/9/2004
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WOW - I cannot imagine how good the first place winner must have been!
Congrats on your win and POTD!


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6/16/2007 12:38:45 AM

 
Donna LaMattino Pagakis
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/12/2004
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Such a beautiful and creative image, great light and colors. A big congrats on your win and photo of the day!~!


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6/16/2007 12:50:39 AM

 
Laurence Saliba
BetterPhoto Member Since: 9/23/2004
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FANTASTIC!!!!


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6/16/2007 1:03:24 AM

 
Ken Ferguson
BetterPhoto Member Since: 5/28/2007
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It is truly an amazing image. You must be very proud. Well done!


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6/16/2007 1:11:05 AM

 
Bill Houghton
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/9/2004
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Beautiful work. Congratulations. Bill


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6/16/2007 1:24:19 AM

 
Janine Russell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/22/2005
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Ali, congratulations on your POTD.


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6/16/2007 1:33:30 AM

 
Lynne Morris
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/9/2005
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Congratulations on your POTD, this is a stunning image Ali.


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6/16/2007 3:26:56 AM

 
Joy Rector
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/26/2002
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congrats on the POTD


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6/16/2007 3:59:37 AM

 
Lorraine T. Abed
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/25/2005
 

Your image is definately unique and nicely composed. Great work indeed.


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6/16/2007 4:04:27 AM

 
Deborah C. Lewinson
BetterPhoto Member Since: 12/25/2003
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newjerseyphotos.net
 

Stunning winner and POTD, Ali, congratulations!


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6/16/2007 4:10:29 AM

 
JO ANN CLEVELAND
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/16/2006
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Absolutely amazing capture! Definitely one of the best ever!

jo ann c.


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6/16/2007 5:36:25 AM

 
Sharon K. King
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/2/2005
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Stunning! Congratulations!


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6/16/2007 5:54:25 AM

 
Susan J. Feulner
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/4/2005
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Great composition - love it all. Only things missing are the tracks in the sand.


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6/16/2007 6:22:42 AM

 
RC  Fritz
BetterPhoto Member Since: 1/25/2006
 

Fantastic silhouettes. Great comp. Congratulations!


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6/16/2007 6:34:19 AM

 
Lindley Johnson
BetterPhoto Member Since: 8/18/2004
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Beautiful warm light and color. Fantastic silhouettes, too. Congratulations on your very well-deserved winner and POTD, Ali!


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6/16/2007 7:03:08 AM

 
Cindy K. Bracken
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/8/2004
 

Wow, Ali - what an amazing image. Congratulations on your win and the POTD!
Cindy Bracken


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6/16/2007 7:10:55 AM

 
Trudy L. Smuin
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/9/2005
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naturessignature.net
 

Wow Ali...This is stunning. All of your work is absolutely beautiful!!


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6/16/2007 8:33:52 AM

 
Colleen Farrell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 4/13/2004
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Stunning! Congratulations on your wind and POTD!


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6/16/2007 8:46:05 AM

 
Michael T. Morgan
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/30/2006
 

stunning...a great capture...


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6/16/2007 9:56:51 AM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

How did you do this?


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6/16/2007 10:46:57 AM

 
Carol A. Wight  

Beautiful!! This would be a wonderful picture to be used at Christmas time. I love it!


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6/16/2007 11:38:14 AM

 
Nancy Donnell
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/23/2004
 

Ali, this is just beautiful! Love the texture in the sand, the warm colors, and the way the palms and behind that, all softly fade out. Congratulations!!


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6/16/2007 12:13:14 PM

 
Helen N. McHugh
BetterPhoto Member Since: 9/8/2005
 

Just stunning, Ali! Congratulations on this brilliant POTD!


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6/16/2007 12:30:59 PM

 
Patricia Ronan
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/15/2006
 

Great image! Congrats on your POTD:)


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6/16/2007 12:51:50 PM

 
Mary K. Robison
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/30/2003
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Big Congratulations on this beautiful POTD!


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6/16/2007 3:41:55 PM

 
Rich Collins
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/24/2005
 

Ali I gotta tell you, this reminds me of the types of movie posters I recall seeing when I was just a lad for Disney. I remember thinking "Wow, this is really some terrific art". I still think that & your's is fantastic. Some PP work makes that moon look like it rests just over the next sand dune. Well done. Congrats on the POTD. Hope we see more.


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6/16/2007 3:49:37 PM

 
Lynne Hoad
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/14/2005
 

Congrats on this stunning, gorgeous image Ali!!!


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6/16/2007 6:01:08 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Are these paintings, photos, or "Photoshop Paintings?" (a new art form, it seems). Really does remind me of a "movie poster" as the other person mentioned. Would love to know how this was done, including the long shadows from the camels. Very arresting photo.


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6/17/2007 11:46:53 AM

 
Mary  Clarke
BetterPhoto Member Since: 2/16/2005
 

Congratulations on POTD Ali, fantastic image!


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6/17/2007 3:28:56 PM

 
Rich Collins
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/24/2005
 

Hi Catherine. Not sure but the movie poster look may be a photo transformed in a Graphics software, maybe Illustator, http://www.totaltraining.com/prod/adobe/illustratorcs2.asp?mscsid=

Maybe Ali can let us all know.


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6/17/2007 4:05:08 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  


Thanks, Rich... I do hope Ali lets us all know. I have come to think of many "photos" and "photo paintings," with all the digital tools available today. A whole new blended art form!


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6/17/2007 5:13:27 PM

 
Kaveh J. Nikpour  

this looks like a photo with illustration on it. The two camels in the back are absolutely identical. I wish the photographer would elaborate on this photo and tell us how much of it is photography and how much is post work. I feel like there is a very gray area here between photography and Illustration, but we are giving a lot of credit to this image as photograph.
just my two cents


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6/19/2007 5:50:55 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Thanks Rich and Kaveh for your responses. I really can't understand what these "comments" are for, if it just "applause" for a picture that another group has chosen as a "winner," or "as the Photo of the Day (POTD)."

There is so rarely any real discussion about the photos, techniques, even the location used, one can't tell the "real" from the "false." I have long loved TrekEarth for it's wonderful critique and commments section, where people can actually learn about photos and how they are made.

In contrast, on this website, with no information given about this particular "camels" picture (I hesitate to call it a "photo") I am at a loss as to what I am supposed to be learning here. What are we doing, except patting each other on the back? It doesn't make any sense.

The pictures, lovely though they may be, so often seem to take on the look of graphic illustration or catalog cover photo shots that I have seen elsewhere. Where does one end and another begin, and how does this fit into the "photography" category? What is the criteria used in choosing the POTD?

Why isn't some kind of description required of a photo that becomes a "winner?" What good does it do to the rest of us if it's just another pretty picture?

Very frustrating for an amateur who wants to learn photo techniques, like me.

But I do want to thank the people who have responded to my questions, as they have been very informative. I greatly appreciate and do thank you for your time. I hope there is something that as a newcomer I am "missing." I would like to find out what that is. Thanks in advance... Sincerely, CT


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6/20/2007 10:28:48 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Kaveh, thanks for your comment about the "identical camels."

<<
from Kaveh N.
on 6/19/2007 5:50:55 PM this looks like a photo with illustration on it. The two camels in the back are absolutely identical. I wish the photographer would elaborate on this photo >>

On closer inspection, it looks like all three camels are identical, with one being a bit smaller. The shadows look like they have been added with another graphic program I came upon recently.

Why are there no footprints for the camels or the man holding the reins? The sand is in perfect waves, with no trace of moment upon it.

Nothing about this picture looks "real," yet it has been awarded TWO PRIZES.

I do not understand what all this means.

Could we PLEASE get a bit more info from someone, the photographer or the people who awarded the prize?


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6/20/2007 10:36:32 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Dear Mr. Seena, I do not wish to say that your work is not striking, but I have found a number of websites with your photos posted. Others have asked about whether your photos were "constructed," and many looked "painted" as well. Please give us a bit of information as to how you have created these pictures.

I found another similar sunset photo at

http://www.usefilm.com/image/1138110.html

To Better Photo, what is the criteria for a "photo" here? I realize the lines may be blurring quite a bit, but some information would be appreciated. Thanks.


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6/20/2007 10:55:36 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

 
Here's what a poster photo looks like:

http://www.allposters.com/gallery.asp?CID=CDFF15C36DCF41B3B0506A8DC6854D7B&txtSearch=camels&imageField2.x=0&imageField2.y=0&CID=CDFF15C36DCF41B3B0506A8DC6854D7B&startat=%2Fsearchadvanced.asp%3FCID%3DCDFF15C36DCF41B3B0506A8DC6854D7B


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6/20/2007 10:57:42 PM

 
Lynne Hoad
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/14/2005
 

Catherine, you've brought up exactly what I have thought many times. Being an amateaur myself I found it frustrating when people would'nt answer any questions about how to do things. There are a lot of people on this site who are great and really helpful, glad to give advice but there are some who just plain ignore your request for info unfortunately. I think any photos that have been edited any more than just a slight crop, lightness and color saturation adjustment should go only in the digital darkroom category. Otherwise it seems to me that it's just not fair on other members who submit 'true photos' and not 'photo art.' This is what I have done with images that I have merged together. And to Ali, this is still an awesome image even if it is technically classed as photo art.


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6/21/2007 12:04:35 AM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Thanks, Lynne... I have felt the same way so many times, and with this picture I just "had to say something." Looking at the gallery, it is clear that many "photos" appear to be mainly "art." Beautiful, but certainly not what we expect on a teaching photo website. I love TrekEarth which has strict rules and a moderator that keeps things informative, and will probably go back over there. People really do respond and it's a wonderful learning experience, and FREE.

Thanks so much for responding. I was very nervous bringing this up, but with other people mentioning the "movie poster" aspect and the replicated camels, I just had to. When there were no footprints in the sand, I really have to wonder who is giving out the "awards" and what exactly are they worth?

Thanks again. Write me anytime. CTodd1000@gmail.com


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6/21/2007 1:10:20 AM

 
Rich Collins
BetterPhoto Member Since: 6/24/2005
 

Catherine I am beginning to think you're point is the most valid point her. This is a photo learning site. So a graphics artist can win without even using a photograph? Hmmm. Suspect indeed as to the staff awarding POTD's & the like. It even caught me at first but I don't know that I've had awarded any prize. It still looks like a movie poster; art.

And the fact that the OP or a moderator will not respond is strange.

Good call Catherine. Patting each other on the back makes for a nice warm fuzzy community, but how is one supposed to learn?


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6/21/2007 5:19:12 AM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Dear Rich,

Thank you as well. I can't tell you how nervous I was posting my comments, questions and concerns... I truly thought I would be "asked to leave" and that my membership would be revoked, or something like that, but so far no one has responded at all. Who knows what the 'morrow will bring. Thanks for mentioning the "movie poster" aspect, as that was what really struck me about the image as well, and with someone else (finally) asking a question, I found the courage to do the same.

I've seen pictures that I swear are almost exact duplicates of catalog cover shots (my gardening catalogs, to be exact) that are "winning" left and right, yet little if any response to requests for more info. Only one person ever did respond when I wrote with questions about the photo, and they said they had photographed the "tulips in Las Vegas" or somewhere like that. Wherever it was, I had never heard of tulips in a hot climate.

TrekEarth.com is a wonderful site that is moderated, where one can "comment" or "critique" and has a "workshop" section where one can really learn from each other. I have gained so much just reading through the detailed comments section, which helps prepare me for my first manual camera.

I really appreciate the people who have responded to my posts here, and hope to see more. To them, I say "thanks again" for your comments, and that will keep me on this site for a little bit longer. I'm here to learn, and it's good when we can all do it together! Sharing is a wonderful thing.


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6/21/2007 6:05:10 AM

 
Kaveh J. Nikpour  

Thanks Catherine, Lynne and Rich,

I am glad to see that I have opened a GOOD can of worms here. Catherine, I found all your comments very refreshing and I had the same feeling of nervousness that you had when I first started writing my comment.

This was my first time ever commenting on a photo. I was somewhat angry that most people before me had given rave reviews of the photo and yet I could see that it was not truly a photograph. Along with a friend, I examined other photos on Mr. Seena's Gallery and I found similar “STYLEs” of work. I would like to challenge Mr. Seena and the judges who awarded this photo with POTD with the chance to analyze and review the photo and perhaps present a compelling argument for it. In general, they should re-assess the judging criteria.

Thanks for the tip on trekearth.

Regards

Kaveh


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6/21/2007 1:15:55 PM

 
Catherine S. Todd  

Thanks to Kaveh, Lynne and Rich and whoever else has responded... this is the first time I have ever been described as "opening a good can of worms!" What a nice way to put it.

I was so nervous about saying anything, but it got to the point as to be ridiculous, especially for a site that proposes to be a "learning facility."

It's good to have met such sincerity where I thought there was none. Check out TrekEarth.com for sure; it's inspiring like no other. I'm going to stay here a bit longer to see if any moderator or the photographer, Ali Seena, ever responds, but I have canceled my subscription to the "photo of the day" as it was really useless. It was not much different than seeing a picture in the pages of an advertising magazine.

With no information given, no criteria for why one photo “won” over another, nothing but another image with congratulations, pats on the back, empty compliments and "rave reviews," what is the point of a daily photo “win?” It doesn't make anyone any money, it doesn't even necessarily generate any work, so what is the point of handing out an "award?" Surely there must be more to earning that award than this.

We in this culture are flooded with images! I need more than just another picture to look at. I have millions of photos to choose from already. I came here to LEARN.

I have no idea what is going on with this website, but perhaps people are on vacation? In any event, let me know if you all move somewhere else, as I would love to see more of each of your work, and one day I hope to post some of my own. It's great to have a real community of people to share with, and learn from and support as we all have so much to offer, from beginners to advance.

Thanks again for all the supportive comments, and I have to thank the first person who mentioned that the photo "looked like a movie poster." That is what got me going and gave me the courage to really ask some questions. Too bad there hasn't been a response, but perhaps later. Who knows.

Now it's to TrekEarth I go. Fantastic shots, and a real community has developed over there. Please feel free to keep in touch. I'll check back here as comments are made.

Your friend in photography, Catherine Todd, ctodd1000@gmail.com


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6/21/2007 8:21:59 PM

 
JO ANN CLEVELAND
BetterPhoto Member Since: 3/16/2006
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Awesome image Ali! Congratulations on a very well deserved POTD AND GOLD medalion!

And to those who are questioning this piece, I suggest you do so privately to Ali in the contact section. To my knowledge, there is nothing that says we can't use Photoshop, etc.? The judges are quite well aware of the rules wouldn't you think?

This is a 21 year old who is doing beautiful work and it appears you are being quite critical. Just my opinion ~
or you could contact BP or write in the discussion area.

Hope you all have a wonderful week, and wishing you all the best in your photography!

p.s. I am a "year old" new photographer too! So what do I know? lol


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7/3/2007 8:00:09 PM

 
Kaveh J. Nikpour  

Hi Jo Ann,

last time I checked, this was a site for better photography. not fake pictures and Illustrations that are made to look like a photograph. We should may be call this site “Better Photoshop”, but then it will not be fair to those photographers who work hard and genuinely shoot amazing photos and therefore are well deserving of their awards. I don't care how old this person is, I hate to be fooled into believing that this is a photograph. I would like the artist or one of the judges respond to any of the comments here or at least honestly explain the image. This is not a photograph. It is a FAKE picture, but a good illustration.

You are entitled to your praise and I am entitled to my criticism.


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7/6/2007 3:48:20 PM

 
Gregory LaGrange
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/11/2003
gregorylagrange.org
 

Funny how I seem to find these conversations.
First. Suggestions about where to discuss photos are suggested to be done so privately. It doesn't make sense to use a feature labeled "discuss photo", to discuss a photo.
Second. Yes it is photoshop. You've answered your own question about how it was done. There are other signs, the focal length required to get the sun that size doesn't match the compression effect of the same focal length.
There's another in the shadows of the camels. There's a complete silhouette of the camel(no detail), but there's detail in the sand from the camel's shadow. Doesn't work unless they are semi-transparent camels.
Third. The back foot of the camel driver. Doesn't sink into the sand. (as well as other foots. Back foot is up, so that stood out).
But regardless, isn't photo of the day just a preliminary thing that somebody just noticed something for a particular day only? Now for the contest, there's legitimacy in the gripes, mainly depending on the two things of which category was it entered in. And whether these are paste jobs of his photos, or paste jobs of somebody else's.


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12/20/2007 3:00:11 PM

 
Gregory LaGrange
BetterPhoto Member Since: 11/11/2003
gregorylagrange.org
 

"in the desert" and "jointly traveling" are the same, except he changed the shadows.
But some are nice representations of the local culture. Personally, I'd call them digital darkroom stuff. But if somebody wants to recognize them if they were outside that category, it's okay with me. You have to look at things like the idea of an image in combination of other things.


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12/20/2007 3:10:40 PM

 
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