 BetterPhoto Member |
Studio Lighting Okay....I've searched and searched to no avail(and to much indecisive confusion) so I'm just going to come right out and ask. Which manufacturer do you recommend for strobe studio lighting (flash/model lights)? To make it easier(?): 1. I'm just starting to delve into studio photography. 2. I'm as broke as the next guy but can raise the money as long as it's in the 1000-1500 dollar range. (Less expensive is always welcome) 3. I know that having a respectable range of accessories also goes toward choosing the manufacturer. 4. By all means tell me what I should avoid like the Hantavirus (I could have said plague but it's the 21st century). I know I'm going to get a lot of different answers because various people have had various success with equipment...but frankly I don't care how many differing opinions I get as long as I can begin to see my way to making an informed decision. So in the immortal words of Montgomery Burns..."Release the hounds."
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Oh Man, I gave up to find an asnwer to this question. I am still looking for good manufacturer as well and I got many choices, and here I got many answers as well and on another websites, and all got thier point and success with specific manufac. they using, so that I can't find my way, and I don't care of money as I can get something ggod enough, but I mentioned that I want lighting that power 2000 and more, in fact I want to get about 2400-3000 not just for models and portraits but for some commercial photography that I need high power if so, and with high power I can lower it but I can't do the opposite. So I am waiting your question to be answered as well. Oh I forgot that what make my question difficult to answer is that I buy only from B&H and I think what I look for can't find on B&H or maybe it is there but I can't find it, so if they will give me another site to buy from then I don't use it and again I keep searching or asking. Good luck for all.
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Mark Feldstein |
You know Chris, this subject has been dealt with a lot around BP. You just need to do some searches here. If you could narrow this down a bit, I'm sure there are some folks here to offer both you and Tareq some suggestions, but you really need to help yourselves first. Generally, you need to define what you plan on photographing, how much power you think you may need, whether you need to be portable or not, intend to use it professionally daily, and how you intend to expand your system, if at all. Remember too, you can get cheap or you can get good. But you can't get good AND cheap lighting equipment. Then you need to decide new or used equipment, pack systems, monolights or even just small portable flash units like Nikon SB 600 or 800s, although you can do some really nice work with simple SB 28's on a light stand with an umbrella. Now as to Tareq, why do you think you need 3000 actual watt seconds of power? You shooting products with a view camera at f45 or f64? If so, take a look at Speedotron or Norman or Elinchrom pack/head systems. Otherwise, monolights like Calumet Travelers, Bowens (makes the Calumet lights), Speedotron and now Photoflex offers some monolights, about 1500 ws max. power. Remember, you take a 3000 w.s. pack and start adding heads and the ratio'd power per head is usually reduced accordingly. To photograph models, you can easily get away with 750 W.S. and a lot less, but it depends on what f-stop you want to be working at as well. In that sense, you can try to match your light output to your primary portrait lens. For example, I prefer using a MF Zeiss 150 mm f4 lens that has a sweet spot about f 11.0. I like using a single 3x4' softbox. To work at f11, I like using a 1000 w.s. monolight with that softbox and that particular lens. Seewhatimean? Decide what you're shooting most of all first, get lighting for that and expand your system with heads or monolights to match what you're trying to accomplish. Also, remember, you can do multiple pops on a lower powered pack system to get to whatever f-stop you need to work at, say f64, without having to lay out the bread for a 3000 ws system. Take it light guys.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Hi Mark. Yes, I want to work with F22 or more if possible, all my lenses get maximum F22-32, so I need that high power for sure to macth my F-stop. Still I don't know much about heads or strobes or sofboxes or umbrellas or snoots and so, I read about them all and I have catalouges of Bowens and Multiblitz and cheap brand and still can't find what all those used for. I am arabic guy, so in DSLR and Meduim Formats I learnt good enough, but still in lightings I find difficult to understand all that equipments even I took a course in photography and used those lightings but it is just as normal used but not professionally. Thanks Mark and I hope I can find out about lighting to decide what brands or power I need, and if you can have a time please then please search in B&H then link me the product you think it is good or at least give me many choices from B&H so I can see which I can get, send the link to my email.
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Mark Feldstein |
Howdy Tareq. I know B&H quite well. Good choice for a reputable place to buy equipment. I highly recommend Speedotron and Norman pack systems, and Bowens monolights. I've used each of those for years and years and never had a problem with them. The older Speedotrons, like 2400 w.s. packs weigh a lot and require their own separate case when traveling or dolly when moving them around the studio but they're extremely well made (in the U.S. btw. :>)) Bowens are really great too. I use them all the time in studio or on location. Lightweight, pack 3 or 4 in a Tenba air case with power cords, etc., and rock and roll. The W.S. you're proposing strikes me as being unrealistic especially for portraits. 750 w.s. for a hair light is a LOT when you can easily use 750 as a main and 375 or less for hair and background. Before you buy anything, put the product catalogs away and get some basic books on lighting for portraits, another for say products, studio work and interiors. You really need to get better grounded in what you need for what types of work AND what modifiers are available to help you. For example, if you use a 1500 w.s. to shoot hair it'd be like a scorched earth campaign. You're just going to blow the details out. And then you'd need twice that for a main, roughly. Let's see, 3000 W.s. Are you making portraits or prime rib? When you shoot large products like cars or room interiors, you rarely use a single pack or light source. Multiple lights and packs all slaved together. For cars, in studio, a giant overhead softbox system uses heads operated by a LOT of packs. I don't think you can do it with one pack. Room interiors, I shoot a lot of. Usually with a few monolights and I can easily work at f11 or f 16 depending on the film's ISO. I don't really need f-22 much with a view camera or any other camera for that matter. If I do I just trigger the lights multiple times using a radio slave and it's a done deal, all the way up to f64 if I want. Again, don't buy an entire lighting array to cover a shot that you'll rarely make. If I'm working outdoors in medium format, I almost NEVER shoot at f22. Usually, I'm at f 11, or 16. That's mostly the sweet spot on my MF lenses. I match my ISO to what I want to set my lens at. Usually ISO 50 or 100 outdoors, depending on time of day etc. Sorry man. I usually don't do someone elses research for them. So, go to B&H and type in Bowens or Norman, OR speedotron and look around. But I strongly suggest that you read up on the technique first, not the equipment.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thank you very much, Mark. I have one question only: when do you need or use 400 w.s and when do you need or use 4000 w.s? If you can answer this question then I can choose and decide easily, because I buy anything I want even if I use it for one time only in my life, thats why I have many cmaeras and lenses as well. so that I said if someday I need 4000 I have it but doesn't mean I will use 4000 all the time, and I can excluding some heads, and I know one friend using 5 heads of Bowens but I didn't ask him why all that, but sure there is a reason to use all that much head, and even that one who told me that he need 2400 w.s sure he has a reason, so even I will not use more than 500 w.s mostly doesn't matter to me if I need to use that 3000 w.s for something, I love to shoot everything outdoor and indoor with any amera or lens and use all settings. So if you clearly describe when we use that high power or low power then I can plan what to get, who knows, I may need high power in emergency time then I feel upset that I don't have that full power available.
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Debby A. Tabb |
Tareq, I sent you a note with some ideas and links, I hope this will add a bit of help as well. Wishing you the best of luck in all your ventures, Debby Tabb
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thank you very much, Debby I don't know how to thank you or rewarding you. i appreciate that alot, I will check your notes, thanks again Regards, Tareq
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Mark Feldstein |
Well, Tareq: First, you have to understand that while different manufacturers state their equipment output in watt seconds, they measure those watt seconds differently than according to the actual standard and usually overrate their equipment. That's common to equipment made in China or Asia or the Phillipines, for example...like, Britek, IMHO. I've seen that and heard it from a lot of people. European manufacturers seem to do an excellent job, as do the ones in the U.S., and I believe the ratings you get from either are pretty accurate, like Elinchrom, Bowens, ProPhoto, Broncolor, and Speedotron. Norman used to be, but I don't know what's going on with them since Bill Norman sold the company. A 4000 watt second pack is a lot of power. In 30 years, I can't recall ever using or even needing that much power in a single pack. 5 heads is a lot of light and sure it's usable but it depends on what you're shooting. Some people teach portraiture with 3 or more lights. I prefer one light with fill panels. Simpler is better. As I think I mentioned, I can do great portraits on location using an SB 800 or a Vivitar 285HV or even a Quantum T-2 portable flash powered by a Quantum Turbo battery and the light bounced out of a 40" umbrella. If I want to get fancy, I can use a Vivitar 285HV on a peanut slave in a second umbrella or elsewhere bounced or reflected off a wall. The whole rig Like I said Tareq, you'd be wise to either take a course here from someone on basic lighting equipment OR read up on the subject of lighting cause I think you're about to spend a fair amount of money for stuff you just don't or won't need, don't know how to use yet and could just grow into later, and/or that could be better invested in other types of equipment for the time being. Unless of course you've got an unlimited supply of funds. Take it light. ;>)
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thank you very much, Mark. I hope you don't think I need to shoot only portraits of one person, I can do groups not less than 10 sometimes in a Hall or on location, so for one person I know that 400 w.s or so is more than enough, but for groups and say some commercial photography of interior designs and so do you think one or 2 lights are enough? Still I don't want to get something so fast to learn on now as I have many books about lightings and read that sometimes I need low power and sometimes I need so high power, and because I love to shoot everything and not just portraits of a single persons so then I have to be ready for what is bigger, in fact I got nice results with natural lights and with my external flash 580EX for my daughters so I don't need more powerful, but when I was shooting in a Hall of an event with my 580EX on full power with F11 or F16 it was underexposure, so I can find that with high power I can get enough lihgt to expose my entire shot, sure I can control those lightings from low to high, but I hope I will not blame you when I use 750ws and telling you that it is not enough.
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Mark Feldstein |
Hey Tareq. Virtually every scenario you've described, from shooting individuals to groups of two or a lot more, regardless of space, can be handled with a whole lot less than a 4000 watt second power pack. I really really really think that if you can't light up the largest scene that you're describing here, using a maximum of 3000 or less full w.s., your light placement needs to be adjusted and you're likely not using what you have effectively. But, I wasn't there, so I don't know for sure. ;>) I didn't rig your heads, place your reflectors or spill kills, choose the locations, set the umbrellas, aim the heads or place any fill panels. So, I don't know. But quite honestly, if you think you need a 4000 watt second pack, please, by all means, you should have one, or two, or perhaps even 3. And when you work on location, a portable generator to drive one or all packs. Honest. And just to be clear, 4 heads of 750 w.s. heads total out a 3000 watt pack if they're all switched to full power. Take it light.
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Mark Feldstein |
Hey Tareq !!! I keep meaning to ask you but I forget, do you have a good light meter that will measure flash and ambient light, exposure average, and measure multiple pops from a strobe? Let me know eh? Mark
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Hey Mark, I don't want to buy one head with 1000w.s power, I will buy maybe 5 heads each 500w.s or 750w.s only, so I can use one head or 2 or 4 or even all heads when needed, and I don't think I want to have a head of power 1000w.s or above, I can use about 2000-3000w.s only I don't think I will do that kind of photography that need 4000 and more, even so then I will ask others to bring more lighting then. about ISO I love to shoot at ISO 50 and 100, I try to keep myself within that range even I can increase the ISO to 200 or 400 or hope not to 3200, so with ISO50-100 and F11-22 and say shutter speed not less than 1/100 do that 200-400w.s enough? I don't have light meter, and I don't think with light meter I have to follow exactly when it is giving as data, I want to keep my settings as I want with ISO or F-stop or shutter speed, not to use ISO 640 because that light meter told me to do or use f1.8 because it is shown in light meter. so, I will not say I want to use 1000w.s for portraits in studio or on Location, but for cars I think even is you use 2000w.s it will not burn the car. BTW, did I say that I want to shoot only portraits? then I think it is my fault that I asked about studio lightings and I should ask about lightings in general. Thanks again.
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Debby A. Tabb |
Places of intrest: The following link is not possible ONLY with the SB800- look at set ups ect. This can be achieved with most slaved flash. Nikon Creative light system : http://www.nikonusa.com/pdf/SB800_techniques.pdf Mono Lights are power adjustable, I have the 2500DR and have been asked many times why I chose so much power, easy: I use only small part of thier ability on a normal basis, but I CAN light up a basketball court if I wish. Photogenic: http://www.photogenicpro.com/ Catolog with a LOT of GREAT Info: http://www.photogenicpro.com/docs/Photogenic2005Catalog.pdf To all Looking into the prospect of buying lighting, do your Home Work! I hope this adds some help,
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Debby A. Tabb |
Oh sorry one more good link: http://www.photo.net/learn/studiolighting/
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Mark Feldstein |
Debby, I gotta ask you: What does this mean when you said: "Places of intrest: The following link is not possible ONLY with the SB800- look at set ups ect. This can be achieved with most slaved flash. Nikon Creative light system" I got the booklet, it came with the flash. Are you trying to say you can't do effective one-light portraits with an sb800 or other portable shoe-flash units on slaves? Does photogenic make a 3000 true w.s. or 4000 w.s. pack system? I've never seen one but doesn't mean they don't.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Hi Mark, I will not buy from this site, but what do you think of this kit? http://alienbees.com/busy.html I like that kit and I want similar to that with another brand like Elinchrom, Bowens, ProPhoto, Broncolor, and Speedotron or Norman. I know that you like light, and I went to many studios in my area and they use only one or 2 heads in some studios, but from the description of that kit link above I can see where I can use many heads and to have power in your hand so you can control it rather than situaions controls you.
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John H. Siskin |
Just thought I would jump in with a comment: I owned a Norman P4000D for almost twenty years. Several things I would say about this pack, first it broke down about ever 18 months, catastrophically. Second I used a 4X5 and 8X10 camera at the time so I used all the power in the pack. Third it was easier to carry than two P2000D packs but less flexible to use in the field. If I were starting today I would try to get 7 or 9 good-sized monolights (750 watt-seconds and a pile of battery strobes. But that isn’t what Chris S might want, since I wouldn’t be starting out and he would. If money is really the problem buy used, Speedotron, preferably or Norman (stay away from the P4000D pack). Tareq if money isn’t the issue, buy Bronco or, nothing better and hugely expensive! Thanks, John
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Mark Feldstein |
You know Tareq, I think you think of lighting in terms of starting to light every scene, whether a room or a convention of people, in a pitch black environment where you have to light everything from scratch. That's appropriate in a studio yes, sure. But on location, which is where I work most of the time, your portable flash equipment is usually used to supplement not completely light, what you're shooting. For example, last year I did a series of shots for a railroad at their maintenance shop and had to come up with supplementary lighting for a locomotive in the shop and the crew of mechanics working on it. 1000 w.s. Bowens monolights and portable flash units, mostly Vivitars, all triggered with radio or IR slaves. Worked great. And...no cords from packs to trip over, even if they'd have reached. I really think you still need to go back a step or two and learn how to use available light with supplemental lighting unless you're shooting from scratch in a darkened studio. And while certainly what John S. is saying is logical, if you were using a 4000 pack and umpteen lampheads, you're movement is limited by cable length to where the pack is located. That's usually not such a hot set-up for architectural work. Oh, and how bout that light meter?
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Mark Feldstein |
What do I think of the alien bee kit you asked me about, Tareq? Colorful. Very colorful. Nice. Cute. I think you need to study up on lighting and learn the basic principle that LESS IS MORE before you buy anything. The information on that web page is very very general. Professional photographers are going to ask a lot more specific questions about all that equipment before even considering it. I don't see it even remotely resembling the capacity to do what it is you want it to do in terms of the high output you continue to say you need and want. Like I asked earlier: Are you shooting portraits or cooking prime rib.
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Oliver Anderson |
I have 3 White Lightning X1600, 1 White Lightning Ultra400, 2 Alien Bee 1600 (Same Company different quality) all with Pocket Wizards and they're AWESOME. They're a great product for the money. I would love to buy the ProFoto's or maybe Hensel Porty but I use them all the time on location with the Vagabond packs and get some Kick A?? photos in crazy places. they're also pretty light and compact when compared to the competitors so I can carry them to a beach or backyard in a couple loads. Makes airtravel easy as well. Paul Buffs customer service is amazing and the replacement bulbs are affordable. I know some VERY talented photographers using this with their ProFoto stuff because the Vagabond is compatible.
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Craig m. Zacarelli |
google "the strobist"
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Debby A. Tabb |
No Mark, That is not what I said , read it again. * " not possible ONLY with the SB800" * "This CAN be achieved with most slaved flash. I have a couple of SB-800's as well. I will not debate with you, but I will state my opinions.
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Mark Feldstein |
Debby, Debby, Debby: Verbatim, copied exactly from what you wrote above says: "Places of intrest: What "following link is not possible only with the SB800?" I have NO idea what you mean. I'm not arguing with you, I'm asking what it meant because it doesn't make sense. That's all. BTW, it's Black's Law Dictionary 4th Ed. (1968) LOL !!!!
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Portraits is not my main only subject to photograph. I work as a civil engineer so I am not a photographer, but because I love Nature and Landscape and Architectural things I can see where 400 is enough for portraits it is not for something else, so what if I said I don't want to use lighting for portraits but for something else: (cars in deserts in different time including the night time, as my friends got alot of cars and 4X$ for desert), I will read more and more about lightings and thats why I asked alot here or everywhere but I found many answers rather than your answer pretend that even 1500w.s can't be enough in some situations, so to reply and debate with them I asked you alot and I want sure 100% from you that 600-1000w.s will be more than enough for many situations (don't consider portraits in studio the main subject because I can do that with my flash 580EX with a reflection or natural lights and get great results). Waiting your answer. Tareq
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Portraits is not my main only subject to photograph. I work as a civil engineer so I am not a photographer, but because I love Nature and Landscape and Architectural things I can see where 400 is enough for portraits it is not for something else, so what if I said I don't want to use lighting for portraits but for something else: (cars in deserts in different time including the night time, as my friends got alot of cars and 4X$ for desert), I will read more and more about lightings and thats why I asked alot here or everywhere but I found many answers rather than your answer pretend that even 1500w.s can't be enough in some situations, so to reply and debate with them I asked you alot and I want sure 100% from you that 600-1000w.s will be more than enough for many situations (don't consider portraits in studio the main subject because I can do that with my flash 580EX with a reflection or natural lights and get great results). Waiting your answer. Tareq
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Portraits is not my main only subject to photograph. I work as a civil engineer so I am not a photographer, but because I love Nature and Landscape and Architectural things I can see where 400 is enough for portraits it is not for something else, so what if I said I don't want to use lighting for portraits but for something else: (cars in deserts in different time including the night time, as my friends got alot of cars and 4X$ for desert), I will read more and more about lightings and thats why I asked alot here or everywhere but I found many answers rather than your answer pretend that even 1500w.s can't be enough in some situations, so to reply and debate with them I asked you alot and I want sure 100% from you that 600-1000w.s will be more than enough for many situations (don't consider portraits in studio the main subject because I can do that with my flash 580EX with a reflection or natural lights and get great results). Waiting your answer. Tareq
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Mark Feldstein |
I kinda hate to tell you this Tareq, but if you start reading you're going to quickly find out that one particular type of lighting source isn't adequate to cover all situations. NOW you're talking shooting cars in the desert at night. Look: I don't think you've really got much of an idea, if any, about what you're trying to do here, what you may need or actually want because you seem to keep changing your own parameters and it's really not up to me (at least) to determine how much light YOU need to shoot some hypothetical project. You really ought to stop using the scattered approach to what you're trying to do, focus in on what you want to shoot primarily, what exceptions, where, how and using what with what kinds of modifiers. START READING BUDDY. M.
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Debby A. Tabb |
Tareq, I think Mark is trying to help to much and getting frusturated. I am sure he didn't mean to come accross so......... Now it is a great thing that you are intrested in SO much, But he is right the lighting for things is different and may require different types for different projects. Portraits , you seem concerned that this word comes up, but a Portrait can be of a Human, Animal or Object, A protrait captures the essance of that SUBJECT. Now, Cars in the Desert very intresting project, but sometimes this takes large light systems, modifiers , and booms. Keep in mind some of the more intricate phtoography techinques are used in photographing Food and Cars- I know this through a Very talented Photographer Auther Coleman, Palm Springs Magizine. Todays advertizers find it much more cost effective to use Photoshop and graphic techniques. But I do wish you the utmust success in this venture and believe the learning process and experiments will be a lot of fun. Just have a blast, Debby
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Oliver Anderson |
Tareq, I photograph cars, models and just recently photographed food. I even have 2 Britek Pro 500's (had to add that for Mark, they're going to be sold soon). I have even worked in the desert with the Vagabond portable pack and its great, a touch slow with all the lights on full power. The White Lightnings are great but if money isn't a concern go with Hensel and the Porty or even better ProFoto (which you can use with the White Lightning Vagabond but their pack is way better). When shooting cars you'll need at least 6 White Lightning X800 or X1600 all diffused.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thanks all. Money is not a big Isuue to me. I took a course in photography and I used 2 umbrellas and I got underexposure in many cases, I have to use widest F-stop and higher ISO, and slower shutter speed to get well exposed shots. I posted 2 photos of my daughter here in BP for contests, both were taken with ISO 1000 and F4 but 1/250s and the original shots were underexposure in Natural lights through windows in Day Time, so what if I want to use ISO100 and F8-F11, should I sit my daughter under the sun? if so then for sure I need strong light as the sun to get that enough well exposure, we all can fix that in photoshop, but I want to be sure I got my right exposure before I do with photoshop. and again, money is not an issue, if I got very high power doesn't mean I will turn on full power to shoot my duaghter, and it is crazy idea if the situation need a power of 3000 at least and I use 1000 only, whatever I try many ways like reflectors or higher that exposyre by photoshop or use High ISO, I read many books and guess what I found, they said that I need for portraits (human) about 800-1500w.s of the power, so should I get 500 and said I am done? I can get excellent results with 500w.s for sure, but I can get excellent results with 1500 where 500 can't. Correct me if I am wrong.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
I am a member in a photography club, and there is a small studio with 1 or 2 softboxes and 1 snoot, I will check them and try them then I will tell you, but I think as long it is very small area of that studio and I am not just to shoot one person I can't end up with right decision, but I will try ISO100 and F11 and see what shutter speed I can get and what power I should use, hope that is enough for you people so to find out what you all try to tell me and explaining to me.
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Mark Feldstein |
Tareq: Got that light meter I mentioned? The reason I asked you that, btw, is to figure out how you're getting the readings you talk about, and why. Hey Oliver, why're you selling those Briteks? I think I know someone who might want to buy them. Debby, thanks for the third-person apology but it's really totally unnecessary because your impression that I was getting frustrated is, well, quite....wrong. :>) Please don't apologize for me, regardless of the circumstances. I'm a big boy. I do that on my own when I think it's appropriate. Okie dokie? Thank you dear. :>))))
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Mark, what brand of light metering should I get? I know Sekonic and another brand I forgot the name, you know good brand or cheap one?
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Oliver Anderson |
the only reason I'm selling the Britek's are because I want to keep all my equipment the same. I want to add a couple more White Lightning or AB X1600's to use in the field with the Vagabond. I like the Briteks Pro5oo's (1st setup) but I got the 6 Paul Buff lights and am buying one more. Next step is to move up to ProFoto like my business partner. Tareq you say money doesn't matter but you want a cheap meter???? buy a Sekonic light meter, I love mine and have the L358 w/chip to trigger my strobs. It really impresses the models.JK
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Hi Oliver, I asked many people about light meter and they told me it is not very necesary but it is helpful, so I don't want to buy a light meter to check it then I find that it is not so helpful to me, metering the exposure can be done if you know how to use ISO, F-stop, and shutter speed, and I told people that it is not MUST to follow what the light meter readings to give me, and I know that light meter devices give you accurate readings mostly but to meter by camera in those Full modes will give you a general exposure settings before taking photos, and in studio with experience I will find myself I don't need light meter, so I buy cheap one that can do the job than another expensive then I throw it after a while, I tried one before and find it is not what I need, most of the time I don't follow what that light meter giving me and I got good results. Let's not be misunderstnading the importance of light meter, I shooted thousands of photos now with camera metering and got good enough results, why now I have to buy light meter? to decide what power should I get or what camera settings should I adjest?
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Debby A. Tabb |
Tareq, You are VERY right, if you are shooting digital and don't mind test shooting it is NOT necessary to use a light meter. Mark, Thats fine, but to show you are a "big Boy" then you have to act like one and not get so angry or "put off" when people have a different opinion then you. You tend to shove your opinion until you irriate others if they don't inially agree with your ideas. Been the receipiant more then once! Have a great day. *And the light meter, is a perfect example of wanting people to spend what they do not need to spend.
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Oliver Anderson |
As for the light meter, it cost about $250 for a good one on EBay (used Sekonic) and is very accurate. With Digital RAW not necessary, but I use it at every shoot inside and OUT and don't have to fiddle with the settings for 10 minutes to nail the correct settings. When shooting vehicles the correct settings are important because the sun moves quickly during with sunrise and sunset so you usually only get a 20 minute window. Don't buy a CHEAP meter for $75 and throw it away just wait till you can buy the right one. ** Tareq just for you I'll add a couple car photos to my gallery.
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John H. Siskin |
Hi Everybody, Just thought I’d throw in my opinions, not any facts here just opinion. I rarely use a meter any more; I have one (Sekonic L-508) so this is a choice. It is faster for me to set the lights guess at the exposure and look at the histogram than to use the meter. The reason is that the meter only tells me about exposure and relative values of my lights; it does not tell me how the lights work in my image. I get that information form the camera LCD or preferably the laptop. When I used film and Polaroid I used a meter because it generally saved one Polaroid per set-up, since Polaroid has a high per unit cost this made sense. Since my guesses are generally very good, because I have a lot of experience, starting with a guess is easier and faster for me. Regardless of whether or not you get a meter I think everyone should practice guessing, someday you might not have the meter. I hate to discuss what lights to buy again here, BUT sooner or later you have to buy some lights. You cannot learn how to light without having lights and getting real world experience. I generally suggest people start with clamp lights (about $6 at Home Depot) these are lousy but you can learn some things with them. Most people buy a poor set of lights first and then a good set. Some people over buy in the first place. It doesn’t really matter; your first set of lights is the tuition at the school of lighting. I strongly suggest that you buy strobe, continuous lights are very limited with digital cameras. Tareq, you first asked me about lights a couple of months ago. You could have been doing lighting since then, but I suppose you enjoy talking about lights. Broncolor strobes, made in Switzerland are probably the most expensive production lights on the planet. They are extraordinarily fine units. They are also incredibly impressive, every time I see them in a studio I know that quality is more important than cost in that studio. Thanks, John Siskin
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thanks John. In fact I want to be sure of what I buy before I throw my money on something then get disappointed, I asked many times that I am not talking about in studio only, I can use one or 2 heads from 300 up to 1000w.s very perfect, but when I use that power in something else I found it is lack, so before I buy something I have to be sure that I get a good correct choice, doesn't matter if that choice is cheap or expensive as long I got something doing the job. Regards, Tareq
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Mark Feldstein |
Hey Tareq: 2000 W.S per head that can be switched or ratio'd down to say 300-350 per head is perfectly fine, probably for 95 % of what you end up shooting and regardless of what modifiers you're using. Among other systems, I prefer Bowens 1500 w.s. monolights for a lot of reasons, but mainly because I just really like them. Which system(s) you get is pretty much personal preference but as most of us here have said, don't buy cheap lighting equipment because more than likely it'll be disappointing to you. I don't use digital cameras much, and as I've said many times here, I'm digitally impaired. So, like John mentioned for those of us still using film, I still shoot polaroids too when I can use a Polaroid back on larger format cameras like medium format and 4x5. But I like using a light meter to zero in my exposures. I have a few meters, again its personal preference. My Minolta Flash Meter IV works well, so does my older Sekonic L328 for in studio work. I also have an old Gossen analog Luna Pro for ambient light that does a great job of metering reflected or incident light readings.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Hey Mark, thank you very much for this reply. So you prefer to use one head of 2000w.s that can be lowered to about 250 or use 2 or 3 heads with all total of 2000 w.s and each head is about say 750 or 800w.s and each can be lowered to 250-300w.s? I think I reached the end of my decided so far but just to be sure, and I will tell you that I will use 1500-2000 for awhile and if I need more power for something else I can add more heads if possible thats all. About light meter I could buy one anyway but not now, and thanks about your advice to not buy cheap lightings, I can afford many cheap lightings in my area anyway but Thank GOD many folks complaining then. Regards, Tareq
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Mark Feldstein |
Well Tareq, I've got a Speedotron 2400 pack that will take 6 lamp heads. The way you calculate W.S. is you can divide the total by number of outlets, so with this pack, 400 ws per head if all 6 are plugged in and switched to maximum per head. OR, one head at 2000 w.s. and another at 400, for a total of 2 heads plugged in; but remember it's not 2400 w/s per head. http://www.speedotron.com/ They've got a number of pack and monolight systems, both brown line and black line. Very reliable, built well, lots of accessories available. quite affordable for pro work. Remember Tareq, sometimes, with lighting equipment, a little less is more and you probably won't find one lighting system that will do everything, but rather lighting systems that will supplement each other to get a particular job done. See what I mean? Your lighting system has to be flexible AND portable, but how flexible and how portable are matters of personal taste based on what your intended use is. If you're not shooting film, you can get away without a meter although I can't imagine working without a meter, but then again, as I've said, I'm still digitally impaired. Take it light Tareq and be well. Here's a link to Speedotron
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Who Me? |
I'm still digitally impaired
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Oliver Anderson |
Tareq, I'm sure Mark F will back me up on this point. You are not ready for Elinchrom, Broncolor, Hensel or ProFoto (I've used the last 3 and bought my White Lightning). The smallest things cost so much money, the beauty dish, the umbrellas, the ring flash. If you don't know what you need you and you'll spend way too much and won't ever be able to use it properly. Paul Buff stuff Alien Bee & White Lightning is affordable, reliable and has very good customer service. I am the type of guy that believes quality wins over price, but I'd say you're crazy if you buy Elinchrom, Broncolor, Norman or ProFoto for your first stuff. It's also scary on location when shooting vehicles because its out in the elements and if a breeze, rain or someone knocks or bumps something its a Very Expensive mistake. Most of the top photographers use 2 levels of equipment one for indoors and one for on location.
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W. |
Yet another one who thinks he can swim as fast as Michael Phelps if only he gets the exact same high-tech bathing suit.
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Oliver Anderson |
It's not the suit....I bought it. It was the goggles I heard. buying those today!!!!
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W. |
LOL! I prefer swimming sans trunks...
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Mark Feldstein |
Sure Oliver, I agree with what you said about those brands, but when Tareq said money is no object, I figure go for the top shelf. And Tareq, Oliver's right about working on location. I use Matthew C stands and a lot of sand bags to help keep them from falling. Very expensive. Scares the Hell out of the models too when a flash tube goes.
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Oliver Anderson |
Double sandbags is a must...Picture this Porsche Carrera GT $500K...small breeze with my beauty dish and it blows over and missed the car by 3 inches. The bulbs blew and I crapped my jeans. The car was unscathed because of the diffuser which blocked the glass, I just recovered and the model is still trying to figure out what happened....That was my scaryiest moment in the last year.
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Tareq M. Alhamrani |
Thank you very much for all these advises and recommendations, I will see what I will get, and I love to learn fast, I got 5 cameras in less than 1 year 3 of them are pro and all digital, so if I got to Film or Large Format it will not be so difficult to me, patience and follow the instructions very carefully are important keys, yourself were newbie to use all those stuff, and with learn and experience you got how to use them, I don't find difficult to begin with simple stuff or so complicated, it will make me to accept challenge and I am very good to protect my stuff very well. Thanks again. Best Regards,
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W. |
Our pleasure entirely. It's always instructive to see a REAL bs artist at work. Haven't the 419'rs zeroed in on you yet?
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Trixie T. |
Alcohol doesn't make anyone prettier, It just makes us not care so much about how someone looks. Get the Picture
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Melissa L. Zavadil |
I owned the briteks for three months they were TERRIBLE!! The light power was insufficient and the control was none. I got so frusterated with the stupid britek lights I sold them three months after I bought them for LESS THAN HALF (because they do not hold their value) and bought the alien bee's man I have been in heaven! Those are great lights! They are powerful and you can control the wattage. The company is beyond great. They will replace anything that you see not quite right and they are on the phone with you walking you through how to use everything. (btw: I'm not a dealer of alienbees just a very happy customer :) ) Melissa
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Oliver Anderson |
I have the Britek Pro500s and they're fine. I've never had a problem with them, had them for over a year and a half. I must agree that my White Lightning and AB's are GREAT and the customer service is amazing.
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