BetterPhoto Q&A
Category: New Answers

For Pros,...What's a Fair Price?

I have a plan of what I'm going to do but am unsure what to charge.
They have offered to cover my expenses for film and processing and compensate me for my time.
I'm estimating around 2 to 3 hours shooting time at the site and another 6 to 8 hours for scanning, sizing, fine-tuning, editing the shots down to the best 30 or so, and loading the photos onto a disc.

What would a professional photographer charge for this type of project?
Since I'm an employee, that must be taken into consideration. I don't want them to feel as if they've been taken but I don't want to sell myself too short either.

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October 23, 2006

You estimated say 3 hours shooting, that's 180 minutes and 30 shots, that gives you six minutes per shot if you only made thirty. To cull down to thirty, let's say you need 90 serviceable shots. If you had three hours to do that, that brings you down to 2 minutes per shot.

C'mon Bob, do you honestly think you can do quality set-ups, lighting and shooting in two minutes per view? Food shots no less? And how much time fixing each shot to color correct, etc. afterwards??? Whew !! I'm beat just thinking about it. And doing it yourself? No. I think not.

Honestly Bob, I think they're just being cheap. Catering companies and restaurants tend to be that way almost as much as real estate agents. But when I look at pricing these kinds of things, I always look at the value of the job to the client. What's my work worth to them in terms of increased revenue through their marketing/ advertising.

Also, there are other ways to do this that are more effective than doing a Charlie Foxtrot in three hours at a venue that's going to be crawling with guests. Try this: Get in, shoot the hall interiors, some close-ups of tables, decorations and capture the general ambiance. Then, shoot the food on a closed set at the catering co. shop. one-dish or a couple of dishes at a time. Yeah, they'll have to prepare them for the shoot. But you work there so you don't have to keep coming over to shoot. Just make a table top set-up, rig a background or two, use that and pop the food down to blast it when you have a chance. Don't try to do the whole deal in three hours. Yikes !!! Even though it's about time for Halloween, that's a bit too scary for even me, LOL !!!
Take it light Bob
Mark

And tell them to shop around.

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October 23, 2006

Also, as a wedding photographer this kind of thing pisses me off to no end. It just is so irritating. I WILL BE DOING THAT STUFF AND PROVIDE IT TO THE VENDORS THAT WANT IT. So, why do they need someone else getting in my way (and, before you say anything, they always say they wont be in my way, and in every case, they are). The reason is because vendors don't think things through, even though you'd think they'd be pros at it all. They send you in there to do all this detail work. Meanwhile, I'm outside shooting stuff, or I'm somewhere doing formals with the couple, and I send my assistant to shoot detial of the room. But, they can't because you are there with your lights, and doing your thing. It's very annoying. This is NOT the time to do a job like this. The caterer needs to either get shots from the pro WHO IS CONTRACTED ALREADY TO DO THIS. Or, to do a mock set up, and have you shoot. In fact, in my last scenario, that's actually the way they should do it.

OK, I'm done ranting. Have fun with the shoot, and get paid a fair amount.

Also, if the pro is like me, he has an exclusivity contract which you are breaking - sort of.

Ah! When will this stuff stop?

And, you know what REALLY floors me, since I'm on the subject? It's NEVER a pro doing this. It's always some guy with a Digital Rebel charging $100, thinking, 'what's the problem, man?'

I'm one of the most cool, easy-going people around. But, this is a hot button. Do you know why? Because a pro would not take a job like this. They would know that the time constraint would make it a failure. It would be impossible. And, I'd be coming in doing shots, and we would be working over each other. Plus, their price would make it unattractive compared to the uneducated $100 guy with a Rebel who thinks it's fun.

I'm done.

Cheers,
Jerry

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October 25, 2006

They're asking you to provide them with a pretty valuable service and they're implying they want this on the cheap essentially because they don't want to pay a pro to do it regardless of reason(s). That's clearly a message that says they don't want to pay pro fees and, IMHO it's got nothing to do with set-up times. What difference, afterall, does it make how long it takes to get set-up if [s]he is working for a fixed price???

Beyond that, however, is the other equally significant issue of what happens if you blow it, for any reason? Pixels get lost, cards don't work properly, files get lost and that assumes the images are technically good to begin with and as you know I'm sure, food ain't easy to shoot anyway. So, if you overcharge, they're going to dislike you. If they don't like the work, they may not like you; and if they put you under a deadline you can't meet for some reason, they won't like you. They're your regular employer.

I'd bow out of this deal gracefully and tell them to hire someone else, as much as I'm sure you'd do a consciencious job to the best of your equipment and abilities. If it wasn't your regular employer, I'd say go ahead. Otherwise, nope. Tell them you don't have the lighting and optics to do their displays justice. And wait'll they see the equipment rental bills !!!!
Take it light.
Mark

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October 25, 2006

Make sure you ask exactly how much time you will have. In my experience, 10 minutes prior to the guests arriving, they are still putting table cloth on the tables. Trust me, it's not this well oiled machine that is ready in plenty of time. And, if this is the case, what is the wedding photographer going to do when they are shooting for their clients, trying to get beautiful room shots, etc for their client, but you are there?

Mark has some great points too. I have heard this several times where employees are taking jobs from their employers. This is a conflict of interest, IMO, and kind of dangerous.

Most wedding photographers worth their salt take all the detail room shots and will provide images of some sort to the vendor. All they have to do is ask the wedding photographer. It will cost them less to do that than it will to pay you to do it.

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October 25, 2006

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October 25, 2006

...Sorry for not responding sooner but I've been away for a few days shooting fall scenics in the Virginia Highlands...(Really beautiful there.)

OK,...Here's the deal:

First of all, I will not be competing with any pro who was hired to shoot the wedding reception. Typically, he or she arrives at the ballroom with the bridal party and my work will be finished by then.

I was asked by the caterer, to whom I'm employed, to shoot a few rolls of the room setup and the display work PRIOR to arrival of the guests and bridal party.
As to them "just being cheap"...I don't believe that's their motivation. Our company just recently hired a professional photographer and a food stylist to shoot plate presentions for the website and for photo albums to show to potential clients.
I don't know exactly what they paid for that but I can tell you that it wasn't cheap.

Catering is a fast-paced, hectic business.
In my facility, we have four ballrooms and we will typically host around 15 to 20 wedding receptions on a good weekend....many with ceremonies. (The largest facility where I will be shooting has 6 ballrooms.)
This means that rooms need to be changed over quickly from the ceremony to the reception on the daytime functions...and then changed over again for night weddings.

Our goal is to have the rooms ready to accept guests 1/2 hour prior to the scheduled start times no matter how tight those change-over times might be. We pride ouselves in achieving that goal most of the time

That said, the ownership of the company asked me to do this because they needed someone who understands the time restraints AND has photographic knowledge and good equipment.
(Many of the room and decor shots they have taken so far are dreadful...shot by one of the V.P.'s with a cheap point-and-shoot digital.)
Whatever I can give them will be an improvement.

I'm certainly not going to quote them $100,...or $4K. (Maybe somewhere in between.)

Bob

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October 25, 2006

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October 26, 2006

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October 27, 2006

I'm curious,...is it really ethical to ask someone who is working for someone else to shoot advertizing material for the caterers for free?
The contracted photog will indeed most likely shoot some of the same things as me but I'll be long gone by then...and the images he or she captures will belong only to the lovely couple getting married.

That said,...I presented my terms and they were accepted so I'm going forward with this project with great anticipation.

Bob

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October 27, 2006